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ine Still Living

by Lord Elamier: 1999-04-01 | 5 out of 10 (2 votes)

Before Winter's Heart - Archive Only: Only Nine People Living Remember the Game

A thought concerning who lives and who does not among the Forsaken...

In the Prologue to the Path of Daggers, Moridin considers that only nine living persons are aware of the board game known as shah'rah (which is something like chess, with a Rand-like figure added). It is a fairly good bet that this nine include himself and the EIGHT surviving Forsaken. If we assume that Moridin, aka "Death," is an authority on which Forsaken have snuffed it, RJ has just told us that 5 of the Forsaken are currently dead.

This "5" certainly includes Be'lal and Rahvin (annihilated with balefire), probably Ishamael, and possibly Lanfear, Asmodean, and Sammael. Note that this adds up to six. My conclusion is that, assuming Moridin is correct, one of Lanfear, Asmodean, or Sammael yet lives, and the other two are dead. Is Lanfear in Finnland? Is Asmodean in that second Mind Trap? Did Sammael skip out of Shadar Logoth at the last moment? One of the three...
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Comments

1

Tamyrlin: 1999-04-01

Excellent questions, although I think you should also consider that Moridin may be including LTT as a living person and one of the nine that would know this game.

2

Val Pui: 1998-11-10

This is regarding the PoD Prologue. I apologize in advance for any mistakes on my part. Let's consider something as part of the start. If Ishamael is dead, and Moridin is a 'new' player on the DO's side, he counts as one living. If Ishamael=Moridin, he still counts as one.

The second point is that we should not assume that ALL the Forsaken knew how to play Shah'rah. For example, if Be'lal didn't know how to play the game, his death would not affect the number of people alive or dead who knew how to play it.

I must admit that I jumped to the conclusion about how many of the Forsaken must now be alive when I read that section. So, let us do a count. Since Moridin laughs about how Rand is 'doing exactly as he (Moridin) wanted', I would think that he includes LTT/Rand as one of those alive who knows how to play it. So far, Rand and Moridin make 2. Now, I will commit the crime of assumption myself. Let us assume that everyone Moridin is referring to is a Forsaken (except Rand) since he says 'from the AOL'.
1.) Moridin
2.) Rand
3.) Semirhage
4.) Mesaana
5.) Moghedien
6.) Demandred
7.) Graendal
8.) Aran'gar
9.) Osan'gar

-Sammael
-Lanfear
-Asmodean

Clearly, there are some possibilities that exist for the information we know currently. One that has been mentioned is that the last 3 listed are all dead. The second possibility is that there is a combination of some know do NOT now how to play and some who are dead. One I can imagine ad lib is Asmodean being dead and 8. and 9. do not know how to play the game. For example, Aginor was too busy making his Gholam and Osan'gar too busy chasing skirts. Another is that Sammael is actually dead as well as Asmodean, and someone from 3-->9 doesn't know how to play I won't list the case that Lanfear (nooo) is dead as I don't think many believe in that.... The other extreme is that three of 3-->12 do not know how to play the game and all 12 are alive. I'm sure there are many possibilities.

3

Tamyrlin: 1999-04-03

You brought up some options that might work. If we assume that Moridin believes Sammael to be alive and that he was the one who helped Rand then you would have to count Sammael. If he does not know if Lanfear still lives then you could remove her from the count...myriads of possibilites which is how RJ likes to leave it :)