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  #61  
Old 04-28-2017, 10:30 AM
connabard connabard is offline
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Originally Posted by fionwe1987 View Post
Egwene too, for me. I loved that she is portrayed as an ambitious woman, and in story, no judgment is attached to it. Sure, Rand goes off on the deep end on it, but that is somewhat understandable, and it is never shown as him being right.

For me, this was offset by the utterly absurd reaction her ambition got from the readers. I'm pretty sure going into forums and seeing how negatively everyone reacted to it was one of the big pushes for me towards realizing the extent of misogyny in our world.
im more ambivalent about egwene. i love seeing protags of stories given 'unconventional' or even 'negative' traits. sometimes egwene did dumb things. she was actively ambitious. she was cocky at times, bordering on arrogant. and while that can be tough to read at times, i did truly appreciate having a protag with a myriad of qualities (which I think RJ just generally did a good job with for the majority of characters)
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  #62  
Old 04-28-2017, 10:31 AM
connabard connabard is offline
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Originally Posted by Davian93 View Post
As an Egwene disliker...My issue with Egwene is more with how BS started writing her (the whole Egwene the girl and Egwene the amyrlin was brutal) along with her mistakes in judgment made while under Aran'gar's compulsion. I think those are pretty fair criticisms that have nothing to do with misogyny.
mostly the same page. RJ wrote her (and Mat (and.... everyone)) with a lot more subtlety which makes it a lot easier to stomach when a character has either negative traits or just ones you don't personally like.
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  #63  
Old 04-28-2017, 10:32 AM
fionwe1987 fionwe1987 is offline
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Originally Posted by Davian93 View Post
As an Egwene disliker...My issue with Egwene is more with how BS started writing her (the whole Egwene the girl and Egwene the amyrlin was brutal) along with her mistakes in judgment made while under Aran'gar's compulsion. I think those are pretty fair criticisms that have nothing to do with misogyny.
I wasn't pointing at specific people.

But I certainly disliked BS's writing of her. That was just awful. RJ did that just a little bit, and it worked. He used it at those moments where Egwene had to force herself to do something her instincts rebelled with. BS made it a feature of damn near every thought of hers and it was just awful. He didn't get what RJ was going for at all.

I don't think there's a shred of evidence Aran'gar compelled her.

And of course she had negatives. I think her biggest was how her fullest commitment to any job she was given sometimes blinded her to other things, especially rules for her own safety. In typical RJ fashion, that was also a huge benefit to her. The question was about the drawing of lines, and by KoD, I felt RJ had her in place to have a very strong moral core to back up her fierce zeal to succeed. By ToM this theme was dead and gone, for some reason...

Last edited by fionwe1987; 04-28-2017 at 10:36 AM.
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  #64  
Old 04-28-2017, 10:14 PM
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Rand al'Fain Rand al'Fain is offline
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Yeah, liking this news!
True, it won't be HBO backing the series, giving it the same quality as GoT. But, has it been confirmed as animated or live-action? If done right, either could be feasible.

And this, combined with the announcements of not only Young Justice Season 3 being in the works, but also a Titans live-action version now confirmed to be in the works, I have a lot to look forward to in tv shows.
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  #65  
Old 05-01-2017, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Great Lord of the Dark View Post
I see the point and need to simplify, but it would bring some tough decisions later. Notably, how do you keep Rand shielded with 13 Aes Sedai if you only ever bothered to show 10 of them? Would you change the size of a circle? If you did then you have enough channelers in your mains that you eliminate the need to collaborate with so many other different cultures, which is a key element of the story.

I think the better approach is to keep in most tertiary characters, and reduce them to 1-2 speaking lines. No need for their life story. But you can't have quarreling Ajahs without at least 1, preferably 3 representatives of each. Then you have to make 1 in 5 of them a Black Ajah or they are no threat. So you need numbers. Less screen time sure, reduced roles, but they need to be there.

Tertiary characters add to the flavour of what Rand must face. He can't just beat evil, there are shades of evil, and Rand must learn that the world is a horribly complex place if he is to lose hope and go dark. I don't mind reducing the length of plots from middle books, but the reason they are there is that the characters are all realizing that you can't do one thing without affecting all the other things, sometimes in bad ways. There are no simple answers. The show can reduce complexity, but it still must appear complex and impossible, leading to those key decision points atop Dragonmount and choosing an axe.
Ah, I wasn't clear.

I'm not saying literally reduce the White Tower to a couple dozen characters. I'm saying that one of the many great things about WoT is the sheer scale of named characters who get multiple lines throughout the books. You can have a few representatives of each Ajah arguing for a couple scenes in a couple episodes, just so we get a flavor for what each Ajah stands for and how they relate to plot, and then never revisit them except as color-appropriate-background characters. You could do Dumai's Well's with 13 Aes Sedai, with only Galina getting a speaking role. Hell, you could have it be Alviarhin, and have her escape back to the Tower.

Obviously, have as many extras as you want, and in most cases they'll be obvious from costuming - Aes Sedai are women with colored shawls, Aiel in cadin'sor, Asha'man in black, etc. But drastically cut down on names and speaking roles. I think it's easy to overlook just how many characters get repeat speaking parts. Do Nynaeve and Elayne really need to hunt 13 (or 11) Black Ajah members? That could just as easily be 3. Or have it be 11 in one quick scene but only ever show Liandrin again, as she's the only one who really matters consistently.

We just don't need Amys AND Bair AND Melaine AND Sorilea to get the point across that the Wise Ones are a bunch of no-nonsense badasses who get shit done and have their own agenda. We don't need Gueyam and Maraconne and Weiramon and Torean to know that the Tairen nobles are grasping, incompetent mooks. I don't need 7 Black Ajah hunters, or half a dozen Andoran nobles pandering to Rahvin. We can eliminate some of the members of the Band.

All I was trying to say is that in just about every possible plotline over the course of what, 14 books? there are four or five characters where, visually, one or two will do. Just making those easy choices can immediately reduce your "cast" from hundreds to maybe several dozen.
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  #66  
Old 05-02-2017, 05:56 PM
Great Lord of the Dark Great Lord of the Dark is offline
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Ah. I was not understanding clear.

An alternative is keep them all, but kill some of them off quicker. Might satisfy those bloodthirsty monsters who complain not enough characters die. A Black Ajah hunt is simpler when you've accounted for 8 of 13 already, and makes the last five more interesting.
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  #67  
Old 05-03-2017, 03:05 AM
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Of course, killing off Egwene a bit earlier might satisfy some too.
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  #68  
Old 05-03-2017, 07:38 AM
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Of course, killing off Egwene a bit earlier might satisfy some too.
"I'm really sorry Egwene died on Winternight Rand but you have to leave the Two Rivers with me and come to Tar Valon..."

Would that work?
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  #69  
Old 05-03-2017, 07:53 AM
GonzoTheGreat GonzoTheGreat is offline
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"I'm really sorry Egwene died on Winternight Rand but you have to leave the Two Rivers with me and come to Tar Valon..."

Would that work?
Oh, that's a tricky one. While it would undoubtedly come as a relief to anyone who had actually read the books, it is possible, even likely, that not all viewers would have picked up why this would be a good thing. So it would depend on how many new people are exposed to WoT through the television series.

Maybe having her drown in bath in Baerlon might be an acceptable solution.
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  #70  
Old 05-03-2017, 11:02 AM
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"I'm really sorry Egwene died on Winternight Rand but you have to leave the Two Rivers with me and come to Tar Valon..."

Would that work?
That would eliminate the need for Bela, though. :/
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  #71  
Old 05-03-2017, 11:32 AM
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Maybe Bela could learn to channel and become Amyrlin. Wouldn't do to have the Seanchan capture her, though, so that's another problem already.
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  #72  
Old 05-03-2017, 12:03 PM
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That would eliminate the need for Bela, though. :/
"Also, I can't believe the Trolloc spear that killed Egwene passed right through her into Master Thane's prized stallion Cloud like that...Bela is the only horse we have left in the stable for you"
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  #73  
Old 05-03-2017, 02:19 PM
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"Also, I can't believe the Trolloc spear that killed Egwene passed right through her into Master Thane's prized stallion Cloud like that...Bela is the only horse we have left in the stable for you"
It's so crazy, it just might work!
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  #74  
Old 08-09-2017, 06:49 PM
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This may well just be coincidental, but perhaps a hint that the show will be on scfy?

http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/watch-r...s-in-5-minutes

Not sure if the clipart characters are just clipart or maybe actual actors?
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  #75  
Old 08-10-2017, 03:20 AM
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I think they're real actors, but probably not actors who are going to have anything to do with the WoT. So the answer to your second question is "yes".
I don't know enough about syfywire and such to even hazard an answer to your first question.
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