he Nature of the One Power
by Nevyn: 2004-05-07 | Not yet rated
Answering this question should lead to answers(or more likely more questions) regarding many other questions. So I will give my theory of what the OP is(please excuse me if I'm repeating a theory, I looked but did not find a similar entry). Anyways, onto the madness...I mean theory. The theory goes that the OP is life-force energy. There is some support to this idea; all of the channelers who use the one power mention feeling much more alive while holding the power, to the point where they can see things more clearly, smell more clearly etc. Consistent with the idea that embracing the source is embracing the source of life.
It also fits with the familiar catechism about the wheel of time being driven by the OP, what else drives time forward exept life? A tree falls in the forr... well you know what comes next.
The source being life-force also goes a great distance in explaining the slowing process, as it is logical that those in more direct contact with the source of life would accrue benefits as a result, above and beyond channeling that is.
Moreover, the nature of the taint seems more defined under this explanation; the taint is not a force of death, although it eventually results in it, it is a force of corruption. Which is why it is allowed to coexist with pure life-force energy. This association of corruption with the DO is borne out through the books, he doesn't seem to desire destruction, merely corruption, hence his dictate regarding Rand. Also, he has not commanded his forsaken to simply use balefire whenever possible, disregarding his question about releasing the balefire which seemed motivated from curiosity if anything, as he did not pursue the issue. But I digress.
Further, the theory jives well with the abilities provided by the one power, save balefire again. The ability to create links between individuals-this is the very essence of life; interconnections. Even the destructive elements of the power go well as the other half of life, the inevitable death of life.
Another question that kind of relates to this; would the taint have healed itself if Rand had not done so? I believe it would have, over a long period of time, men who can channel pull the taint into themselves while they use the power and it doesn't leave them, it causes their madness and corruption, and so is pulled from saidin. Over a long enough period of time this action would purify saidin (in my view anyways).
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1
Tamyrlin: 2004-08-05
(Frenzy for Tamyrlin)
At first i was worried you were going to make a Star Wars parallel.
I like the concept that channeling clean Saidin will reverse the damages of the Taint. We could see if this is the case in the next book, if Rand grows more lucid. Then again, he has the Shadar Logoth wound corrupting him as well.
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Zaela Sedai: 2004-08-05
I seem to remember RJ saying that since the taint is gone noone wil get any worse by channelling saidin, however the effects that are already there will not leave or be able to be healed. Callandor's better with the interview quotes, he'll probably post it if he hasn't already:)
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mako0424: 2004-08-06
i like alot of the ideas u propsed, but besides that the consequences are few, and the only theoritical parts u named, i dont think are to exact, RJ has said that all the asha'mans tainted madness and what not will stay the same, but i agree with it being a Life source of sorts.
i also agree that over time, saidin would have cleansed itself whether men take in the taint or not, i think it has been struggling to be balanced for a long time now, but it would also probably have taken Ages, in which it would have been forgotten
Rand sped this process up a bit
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Callandor: 2004-08-06
Can't remember if I did.
**Q: Does the healing of the taint reverse its previous effects? Or does the victim have to live with whatever he's gotten to that point and be grateful it won't get worse?
A: The second.**
**Q: When/ If Rand manages to remove the taint placed on saidin, are the people infected with it cured? or does their condition remain the way it is?
A: when/if the taint is removed from saidin further ill effects are stopped but what has already occured remains.**
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ishkabibble: 2004-08-07
I like this theory especially about the fact that saidin might have eventually cleansed itself. However, it seems to me that, instead of getting better, Rand would much likely become worse, seeing as how he practically drew every bit of the taint through himself in order to cleanse saidin. I mean, he had to channel practically all of saidin, and thus all of the taint, correct?
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rand bloody althor: 2004-08-10
It is feasable to say that the one power is the life blood of the planet, having pointed out some side effects of the one power as you did. But "taint", by definition, implies a stain, contamination, or causing of decay. Decay does not simply reverse itself over time. (Eventually, age causes decay. Alot of people aging will not dissipate the effects of age.) Unless manually reversed, as Rand did to the taint, natural order would point toward chaos, not the dissipation of the taint.) It is feasable to say that the Asha'man already tainted/stained would not recover any lost sanity, bc Rand did not fill any decayed holes. He simply stopped any new stains from forming.
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a dragonburned fool: 2004-08-12
This theory is a good step in the right direction. Life-force, force of intercommunication, of cosmic communion - that really seems to be the fundamental thing about OP. The formula about the "life-force" is yet too non precise and has too ambivalent implications, but every serious theory about OP must include or at least been compatible with it.
Good thought is also, that the taint is not a death-force, but a force of corruption. It is important for the whole pattern of WoT-cosmology. I will add, that the True Power is also not a death force, but a life-force like OP, but a force of substantially, originally and fundamentally corrupted and twisted life, a force of "alternative" to life. That's why TP is experienced similary to OP, also making the channeler feeling more alive then without it.
However I don't agree with the other implications. I disagree that without the cleansing the Taint could heal itself after long period of time. It's because I disagree that the men absorb and consume it. Rather the taint passes through them and causes it's effects in them. The result of the Cleansing on the asha'man is evidence about it: The taint is cleansed, more channeling now causes no more disease effects, but the effects until now remain. That makes me to conclude, that the taint is not remaining in the channeling men, but it rather only causes an effect in them and passes away. This effect is a permanent process, but it's not the taint itself. It's something like Machin Shin in the ways: the taint is what caused it, the taint is it's parent so to say, but Machin Shin itself is not taint. The taint rather is changing the code of the OP-originated processes, of the life-processes. The taint is rather a cancirogenic factor then a poison or parasite: it is not the cancerous substance itself - it is the substance that causes normal vitale substances to produce cancerous phaenomena. Also male channelers don't just feel the taint in them, they are feeling the taint only near the source when they are touching OP. It's not coming into them, it goes through them and leaves results.
I disagree also that channeling pure saidin can reverse the effects of the taint. It doesnt' fit into Your own system. The taint is not a force acting against the Life-force, it's not opposite to OP, it's not death-force. The taint rather is acting in direction aside, it doesn't reduce the life-force, but it is twisting it. Rand has channeled both pure and tainted saidin, and he doesn't feel the tainted saidin to be weaker or not-so-vivid then the pure saidin. Rand's experience is that both the pure and tainted saidin are the same, but in the pure saidin the tai nt is just absent. Taint is addition to saidin, not a force against it. It's not saidin that acts against taint, but the Shadar Logoth evil. The Cleansing scene shows that it's SL-evil that acts against the Taint. SL-evil also twists the living substance of the world, but it twists it in the different direction. So the taint and SL-evil neutralize each other. But they do not affect what is already done either by taint or by SL-evil, this neutralization is only about more influence. I.e. the force is one thing, the effects other. And also the OP-force affects some aspects of the reality, the taint - another aspects of it. These aspects are not intercommunable. Each of the aspects has it's own impact on the whole reality, but not on the other aspect. The dimension in that works simple OP is not the dimension where the effects of the taint work. The organism cannot detect the tumor and supports it as it supports it's own organs. OP not utilized in specific weaves, cannot distinguish between different effects of the light force. For the OP every possible weave (i.e. every possible effect) is equally valid. Only specific weaves can act agains each other's effects.
So a conclusion: only specific weaves could maybe clean the already caused effects of the taint. Simple touching of pure saidin couldn't. So some ter'angreals could (they are utilization), some weaves that are not dedicated to anti-taint healing, but has it as sideeffect, could do it, but there must be specific utilization of the OP, not just any utilization of it. The effects of the taint are specifit defects in utilizations and only specific antidotes could fight against.
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Nevyn: 2004-08-13
There has been some confusion, I didn't mean to imply that channeling saidin would reverse the effects of the taint on an individual. I meant that the channeling of saidin would ultimately have healed saidin itself, because the taint would be pulled into the channelers, each instance of channeling making the source that much cleaner.
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matoyak: 2004-08-16
hello no one :p! see you've read katharine kerr's novels of devvary and the westlands!
i only had time to read the first one but here goes.
the taint totally covers all of saidin (in a loose term) so it can not be used up or else you would have to pull ALL of saidin into you which is not even possible with the CK.
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Callandor: 2004-08-17
**the taint totally covers all of saidin (in a loose term) so it can not be used up or else you would have to pull ALL of saidin into you which is not even possible with the CK.**
The taint is not infinite (or take the stance that Rand did not Cleanse saidin totally, and I can easily tell you how wrong of a stance that is). Saidin is infinite. Something that is not infinite, can be used up in time.
However, that depends on if a man does draw a part of the taint into them or not.
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Flinn Sedai: 2004-08-17
Nobody else seemed to point this out, but the reason that you feel more alive when holding the One Power, is because of adrenaline.
I believe that adrenaline is pumped out to increase reaction time, see better, smell better (all effects of adrenaline) so that the channeler will be able to win in the struggle for control. This would explain why people feel tired after channeling.
If people were drawing in life energy, they would feel pepped up after channeling and be ready for a new day. Recall the physical exhaustion that Nynaeve felt while using the CK. She was pumping out immense amounts of adrenaline. She had no way to stop her body from creating and dispersing the adrenaline, so the ohysical strain got to her.
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Nevyn: 2004-08-17
You make some good points flinn, but I don't agree with you because if the power did consistently wear a channeler out(as it in all likelihood would if it engendered that kind of adrenaline pumping ) then channelers wouldn't live very long. Channeling would be damaging; the reverse seems to be the case.
I won't argue that channeling is difficult; that channelers tire and can be incredibly worn out(as Nynaeve was) but so does exercise for example; that doesn't mean that people aren't meant to exercise. It increases health and well being, gives a longer life etc. that doesn't mean it's always pleasant. In fact the parrallels are there; pleasure in holding the power, pleasure in running(endorphin; runner's high). At the end, exhaustion, in both cases.
PS, yes that is the derivation of the name, although I haven't read all of the books, at least I don't think so; I stopped at "The Bristling Wood" I believe, for some reason I stopped reading them....I don't remember why; that was a while ago.
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matoyak: 2004-08-27
hmmmmm....well i agree they are good books...get A LOT better after bristling woods....even though i only just finished reading the dragon revenant...
callandor, i know. i was useing it in a VERY loose way. i know that you draw in through the tainted opening and that the taint is finite...i joined the faction remember?
