1
Tamyrlin: 2003-06-18
Concerning the lack of a heronmarked sword, I think Lan doesn't want the attention that Rand got by wearing one. People remember heronmarked swords, while Lan would rather not be remembered most of the time. So, while he deserves one, I doubt he would ever wear one. About Lan's possible future in TG, maybe Lan will save Moiraine somehow (since Moiraine will be back and will be at TG), enabling Moiraine to do something she has been planning. Okay, so I don't have any great ideas as to what Lan will do, but I am sure your case can be made; he could end up fighting someone, although, the OP and TP are more than enough of a match for Lan, and if Shaidar Haran can control Forsaken, Lan would be child's play. Maybe he fights Fain. :)
2
Callandor: 2003-06-18
He's the protector of Nynaeve and Moiraine, can you tell me of an even MORE tiring job then that in the LB?
3
rubbernilly: 2003-06-18
The sword he wields is the Sword of the Malkieri Kings, and is not heron-marked. That does not diminish how special it is to Lan. It is the one piece of his people and his home that he still carries. I can't see him giving that up just for the mark of a heron.
And as for his role, I think he may have two large parts to play:
1) killing Isam (while Rand kills Luc)
2) Possibly raising the - what is it? - Golden Crane of Malkier to rally men to the last battle after Bashere and Agelmar - two of the greatest living generals - are killed.
I mean, if you're the shadow, and you know TG is coming, wouldn't you try to kill the great generals that will fight for the light? Try to kill them before open hostilities begin and they are unreachable? So the shadow would be smart to strike at Bashere and Agelmar, Bryne and Ituralde.
What the shadow does not know is of Mat's memories that make him as much if not more of a general than those others, and of a certain lost prince of a certain overrun land. Lan. He knows his way about a fight, he was able to foresee all of the suggestions that Mat had regarding the attack on Cairhien when the Aiel first came out of the Waste (otherwise he would not have been able to test Mat's abilities), and men will naturally flock to him if he were to raise the banners of Malkier (revisit the arrival at Fal Dara at the end of tEotW). Now that he is free of Moiraine, he can fight the shadow on his own terms, and with the open-warfare of TG, there is no more need for subterfuge.
Nynaeve, too, has taken to the notion of Malkier (her sequences in the ter'angreal in the WT show her in Malkier), and she puts on the kissain dot on her forehead as soon as she learns it was a custom in Malkier.
So will we see the emergent General Lan Mandragoran? That would be a nice bit of character development, I think.
4
Lewin: 2003-06-18
Well, i dont really agree with that Lan hasn't really done special... I mean after all he saved Nyneave's life in the sinking boat and probobly everyones' lifes a couple of times back in tEotW.
5
Rand alThor15: 2003-06-18
Yeah, i'm with my sword on this one. Nyn and Moirane willd be using the power like maniacs and everyone knows that you get dead tired after using it a lot, he will have to protect them and i think he will probably fight some good swordsman ( not good as in Light-follower, but good as in he kicks ass but is a fool for following the DO ).
6
Vaughn882: 2003-06-18
It's not as if being uncrowned King of Malkier is useless. People in Shienar say several times in tEotW that if Lan were to raise his banner, hordes of people, scattered Malkieri and even non-malkieri would flock to fight for him. This could prove very useful in a tight situation.
Also, don't forget Slayer, who being half of Lan's cousin (i guess?) is a likely cannidate for him to fight, and I'm sure Nynaeve's gonna need some protecting.
7
Flinn: 2003-06-18
All right, here's a couple of ideas
1. Lan will fight Luc/Isam, being related to Isam, who played a part in the downfall to Malkier.
2. Lan will rally men around the Golden Crane and maybe resurrect the Seven Towers (at least for the LB)
3. Lan will die protecting Nynaeve.
Again, these don't have much evidence if any and are only thoughts.
By the way, I think Lan met Moiraine somewhere in the Borderlands and threw her into a pond. It's in one of the books.
8
juitzhead: 2003-06-18
Lan and Moraine met after the Aiel war when Moraine was searching for a newborn DR where she made him her warder. I do think that Lan will rebuild Malkier. Min had a viewing of him in tEotW.
"The War... ah... Master Andra has seven ruined towers around his head, and a babe in a cradle holding a sword, and..." - Min, about Lan, tEotW ch.15, p.215"
what i think is overlooked is that Mins viewings foretell the future, not the past. Yes, Lan was a baby when he got the Malkier kings sword and Malkier was overrun, but i think this indicates that Lan will have an heir to Malkier.
And yes Callandor, keeping Nyn and Mori alive at the LB should be enough for anyone!
9
Weird Harold: 2003-06-18
"Lan is the last of the Malkieri but now with Moiraine out of commision he hasn't done much but fret after Nynaeve. What purpose could he have?"
Lan's "purpose" is to be King of Malkier Reborn. He'll incidentally be critical to Nynaeve's survival and growth to meet her destiny -- aside from being the quenn and mother of Malkier Reborn.
Lan has done enough "great deeds" to justify his part in the story and inclusion in Min's Viewing -- they just aren't flashy or earth-shaking.
"One last thought, does anyone know when Lan met Moraine and how? And why doesn't Lan have a heronmark sword,..."
Lanmet Moiraine in New Spring, a Novella included in the anthlogy _Legends_ and son to be exapnded into a novella length prequel (due out before book 11)
Lan's sword is the "Sword Of Malkieri Kings" and far more significant to him than any Heron Mark blade could possibly be. It is power-wrought and the equal in quality to any Heron Mark blade even if it wasn't an integral part of WHO Lan is -- the "Uncrowned King of Malkier"
10
Dorindha: 2003-06-19
In relation to Lan's sword, it is either during tEotW or at the beginning of tGH when Lan compares his and Rand's swords, and apart from the heron, they are virtually identical. The reason Lan doesn't have a heron is because there were very few heron-mark power-wrought swords around, and the past Kings of Malkier had to make do with a plain one. Lan didn't choose his sword himself, as he inherited it from his predecessors. I believe there are other heron-mark swords around, made of ordinary steel (Toram Riatin's sword was heron-marked though I can't remember what is was made of) to designate blademasters, but a power-wrought one would be better than that any day.
Otherwise, I don't think Lan has much to do for a while. If we meet Moiraine again (I'd like to think we will) he might have another stress about his love for Nynaeve and duty to Moir, but I reckon Moir will send him back to his wife with her blessing.
11
Allie: 2003-06-19
Maybe there'll be some sort of joint project between Nynaeve and Moiraine...I don't think Nynaeve has fully gotten over her resentment of Moiraine. Knowing Moiraine, she's probably got some grand scheme in mind for when she does return.
12
jaellon: 2003-06-19
The one thing that jumps out at me as setting Lan apart from the other six is his lack of leadership roles. I can think of no case in which he was higher than second-in-command (so to speak):
Moiraine: Led the party out from the Two Rivers.
Rand: Rules several nations
Mat: Leads the Band of the Red Hand
Perrin: Governs the Two Rivers, and leads a band of Two Rivers men.
Egwene (also part of the party): Is now the Amyrlin Seat for the SAS.
Thom: Took charge during the escape from Shadar Logoth of Thom, Rand, and Mat.
In no case that I can think of has Lan ever taken charge. He has acted independently more than once, and taken plenty of initiative, but never commanded. He followed Moiraine up until her death, then went straight to Salidar where he submitted to Myrelle and later Nynaeve. I think his time is coming, when he will raise the banner of Malkier, and command the armies that follow him.
13
Shadow Bane: 2003-06-20
Rubbernilly I really like your idea that Lan would revive the Golden Crane of Malkeir. This would make alot of sense concerning the uneasyness at the borderlands right now. This is probably the answer to what Lan's next big move will be.
14
Anubis: 2003-06-20
no, i think that nynaeve is not gonna go for the revenge on moiraine. nynaeve has seen too much and been through too much to still be mad at the fact that moridin disrupted their lives in the two rivers.
15
Callandor: 2003-06-21
Lan has risen the banner before hand in battles in the Blight. So he's been more then second in command.
16
Corlm: 2003-06-22
Im not sure but I think there arent a whole lot of power wrought blades but I think there are. though i dont have any proof I dont think theres proof the other way either
17
Niahanchi: 2003-06-24
Since Nyneave and Lan are married now, it could very well be that his part won't be revealed until her part is finalized.
18
Fade: 2003-06-25
I was just rereading the prolouge to tPoD, and i think i found what Lan will do. in the prolouge, the borderland rulers meet and begin to head south. i believe that Lan will eventually come accross them and take control. he will raise the banner of Malkier and lead the borderlanders at Tarmon Gaidon. i know this is very vauge, but i think that there is some potential here.
19
Shadow Bane: 2003-06-25
Fade-
I had this same thought the other day, but your right there's not much we can do but RAFO (sigh)
20
rubbernilly: 2003-06-25
Fade -
I had written that I expected to see the General Lan very soon, raising the Golden Cranes. I like the way you tie in Lan's rise with the gathering of Borderland lords in Andor. Very tidy bit of connecting the dots, that.
21
Rhodric: 2003-06-30
yep, Lan and his Golden Crane standard will lead the borderlanders to TG.
could this be their intention, even? (okay, one of their intentions, 13 AS... AAAARGH)
Moiraine can be quite persuasive, and she likes to write letters...
22
Shadow Bane: 2003-07-01
Rhodric-
So are you saying Moiraine is alive somewhere?
23
Rhodric: 2003-07-01
well yes she is somewhere (Finnland, Rhuidean whatever). but that's not what i meant.
i meant she could have written letters to certain borderlanders before she died. and once they got them, other borderlanders were informed, and they eventually met up in the black hills.
it's possible she wanted them there, due to visions from rings, answers from Finn.
24
Daekyras: 2003-11-26
I have always thought of Lan as the most intriuging of the main characters. He, for all intents and purposes should have been killed off by now. Forget his "love" with Nynaeve, that just seems convenient for RJ to add some tension. He no longer serves any real purpose. Or does he?
Look at the facts:
1. He's the worlds premier Swordsman.
2. He's the King of a lost yet loved country
3. He is still unhinged after the "death" of his aes sedai.
4. He has a lot of past knowledge after his travels with moiraine.
5. He appears to be doing very little at the moment.
This is a long shot, but I have the idea that Lan gets wind of Moiraine's possible location, goes and picks up some reinforcements(Borderlanders) and rescues her. Also, may result in massive battle between Lan and Borderlanders, Masema, Aiel and Perrin etc.
I know it's a bit dubious, but cool none the less.
25
brigitta: 2003-12-15
eemm... I might be wrong, but weren't the seven that left Emonds Field Rand, Mat, Perrin, Moiraine, Lan and Egwene (that is 6) with Nynaeve (7) following them? not that it makes any difference , but Thom wasn't among them so he has no role to play... as to Lan, I like the prediction about an heir and the one about him leading the Malkieri troops. But then again, isn't it enough to be a mentor to DR?? To teach him the sword, manners, tactics, some stuff about the Game of the Houses (OK, that was mainly Thom's and Moiraine's doing, but still) and that pretty saying Rand uses as a motto :"duty is heavier than a mountain..."
26
mako0424: 2003-12-24
Definitely will raise the Banner of Malkier again, with one of the strongest channeling women as his wife, and Sharina Sedai (the strongest so far right? after maybe Alivia). I think Lan will unite all the Borderlands and their armies, and form an alliance with Tenobia and the other Royals, and they will fight in TG, and than after Tg, the rebuilding will begin with Nynaeve already being pregnant and the rest of the Borderlanders helping Malkier with much supplies and aide.
Sound good?
27
Anubis: 2003-12-24
no no no no
it was rand matt perrin egwene moirine lan and thom with nynaeve following. so thats 8 i guess.
28
brigitta: 2003-12-29
I am very sorry about that blooper earlier... yes, that does make 8... reread it and, man, did I feel embarassed... anyways, if it says 7 of them are bound together, does it mean, that there must be 7 altogether (then Nyn could take Moiraine's place) or does it mean that M has to be alive as well??? As to Lan, I expressed my thoughts earlier...
29
rubbernilly: 2003-12-29
from a purely literary standpoint, there is another reason why Lan is so intriguing:
We have *never* gotten a chapter POV from him. RJ does this on purpose, I think, to keep a shell around Lan - separating him from the reader. The reader wants to identify with him, but we never see his POV or his thoughts. He remains aloof, untouchable, solid as a rock, and an archetype.
We've even had a POV from Shaidar Haran, but not from our favorite ronin.
30
OKflyboy: 2004-02-03
Taken from: The Eye of the World... Strangers and Friends
Rand shivered. “And what did you see?”
When you're all in a group? Sparks swirling around you, thousands of them, and a big shadow, darker than midnight. It's so strong, I almost wonder why everybody can't see it. The sparks are trying to fill the shadow, and the shadow is trying to swallow the sparks.” She shrugged. “You are all tied together in something dangerous, but I can't make any more of it.”
“All of us?” Rand muttered. “Egwene too? But they were after-I mean-“
Min did not seem to notice his slip. “The girl? She's part of it. And the gleeman. All of you. You're in love with her.” He stared at her. “I can tell that even without seeing any images. She loves you too, but she's not for you, or you for her. Not the way you both want.”
“What's that supposed to mean?”
“When I look at her I see the same as when I look at... Mistress Alys. Other things, things I don't understand., too, but I know what that means. She won't refuse it.”
“This is all foolishness,” Rand said uncomfortably. His headache was fading to numbness; his head felt packed with wool. He wanted to get away from this girl and the things she saw. And yet... “What do you see when you look at... the rest of us?”
“All sorts of things,” Min said, with a grin as if she knew what he really wanted to ask. “The War... ah... Master Andra has seven ruined towers around his head, and a babe in a cradle holding a sword, and...” She shook her head. “Men like him- you understand- always have so many images they crowd one another. The strongest image around the gleeman are a man- not him- juggling fire, and the White Tower, and that doesn't make any sense at all for a man
*****
Okay, here's the quote in question.
In regards to brigitta's comment about "Thom wasn't among them so he has no role to play". Not to nitpick or anything, but she doesn't actually say "you seven". She actually says "You all". Plus she actually gives specifics on her viewing of Thom.
However, Anubis, at the time of her viewing, Nynaeve hadn't yet caught up to them, so it was, in fact, just seven...
As for Lan not doing much to justify Min's mention of him. What she says significant.
“The War... ah... Master Andra has seven ruined towers around his head, and a babe in a cradle holding a sword, and...”
Just like juitzhead, this leads me to believe that Lan will have an heir, to whom he will pass on his sword and ring.
“Men like him- you understand- always have so many images they crowd one another."
'men like him' I always assumed shewas trying to be discreet and just didn't want to say 'warders'.
That's it, that's all she says about Lan. not much really...
However, I really like the idea of Lan raising the Golden Crane banner and ralleying the borderlanders, however. Especially (having read New Spring) knowing how many people flocked to his banner the last time it was raised...
31
minalth: 2004-03-30
why does thom have the white tower as an image that min sees? has he already had something important to do with the white tower that I have not seen (except for having lots of dealings with aes sedi, which all of the main characters have had) or is that yet to come. Could he (or moirane who he might save and go with aferwards) be instrumental (spelling error?) in healing the tower?
32
Birgitte: 2004-07-20
Minalth-
I might be wrong but I always thought that the viewing of the White Tower had to do with Thom's nephew, Owyn, and Thom's problems with the White tower because of him. But that has to do with the past, not the future so I'm not sure anymore.
Does it say anywhere that Min's viewings are only of the future? Is it possible that they just show the most important things in a person't life?
33
Frenzy: 2004-07-20
the nature of Min's abilities is something 4Alethinso & i have debated extensively. Here's what the books say,
Eye of the World CHAPTER: 15 - Strangers and Friends: "She says I see pieces of the Pattern. " Min gave a little laugh and shook her head. "Sounds too grand, to me. I just see things when I look at people, and sometimes I know what they mean. I look at a man and a woman who've never even talked to one another, and I know they'll marry. And they do. That sort of thing.
Min sees pieces of the Pattern. Most people think she sees only the Future. i say that, based on Min's description of her own abilities, she also sees identifying truths about a person. The laughing face above Mat's head, the sword-wielding babe and seven towers around Lan, that sort of thing. Keep in mind that when Min saw the Towers around Lan we hadn't been told that he was the uncrowned King of Malkier, that came later in the book.
34
Birgitte: 2004-07-21
Okay, thanks
Then personally, I'll be sticking with my first assessment and saying that Min's viewings of the broken towers and the baby with the sword around Lan and the White Tower around Thom are about past experiences, until some comes up with some evidence that proves me wrong.
