lanna's Fishy Little Scheme
by Daishan: 2002-12-01 | Not yet rated
Hi everybody.
I'm rereading the whole series for like the zillionth time (hope to finish JUST before book 10 :-) ). Point is, I came across some passages in TSR about Alanna. Everybody now sort of agrees that Alanna is no darkfriend because of the viewing Min had of her of not betraying Rand. But there is definitely something weird going on with her. She's going to play a big part yet. Think about it. She is introduced in I believe book 2 or maybe somewhere in the beginning of book 3. At Egwene's accepted test she acts really strange (wanting to share punishment and all).
At the time this is dismissed by the Amyrlin as "Arafellin behavior" but it's not really like RJ to do something like that without a meaning. Especially since she is so much remarked upon in book 4. When Perrin goes back to the Two Rivers, Alanna is there with Perrin. He is suspicious of her and so asks Loial to watch her. Loial later says that she vanished twice and that Ihvon SEEMED SURPRISED SHE HAD LEFT. So apparantly she masked her bond, as we later learn is possible. Why would she do this?
Right now I'm about halfway through book 4 so correct me if I'm forgetting something that happens later on, but I believe that just remains unexplained. Also, in the mean time, Verin tells Perrin to be wary of Alanna. She makes the most interesting remark there, something like; "There are many designs in the Tower, and though not all are malignant by far, it isn't always possible to say until it's too late. And even the most benevolent might snap a few threads out of the Pattern. A few threads snapped in the weaving of the basket. A ta'veren would make a very useful thread for any number of designs." I don't think I have all the words correct but it's fairly close to the mark.
So that's three indications pointing to something strange with Alanna already, and as soon as book 4, when she really hasn't done anything noteworthy for the story.
And then of course later on there is the much disputed bonding. Compulsion or no, ta'veren chance twisting or no, again it's something fishy coming out of the direction of Alanna. So if anybody else paid more attention than I did to other passages where she is mentioned, please feel free to jump in.
I agree that she is probably not a darkfriend, but there's this freakin' HUGE gray area between 'not betraying Rand' and not being up to something. Some people might say of course that the bonding is the thing she was up to altogether but I think that's too simple. By the way, even the bonding is only a means to an end; she wanted to control Rand. Since she found out she couldn't do it through the bond, wouldn't she try something else? Well, that's it for me. If anybody thinks I'm talking nonsense, please let me know so I don't have to lay awake at night anymore :-)
You cannot rate theories without first logging in. Please
log in.
1
Tamyrlin: 2002-12-01
Okay, so I haven't ever thought of Alanna as an "independent" in regards to having something up her own sleeves. She has always seemed weak to me...and since she bonded Rand she has appeared useless. But the points you bring up, when thought of with the idea that she was in control at all times, makes you wonder if she is working some odd angle that RJ isn't telling us. Do you think she is working for someone? Maybe from the Tower? Darkfriend seems unlikely, but maybe Verin suspects something...ccomments anyone?
2
Daishan: 2002-12-02
Well, most people seem to think Verin is behind everything Alanna does (e.g. The Bonding). Although it's very much possible, even likely, that Verin had something to do with the bonding, I don't think she has control over all of Alanna's movements. As book 4 indicates, Verin isn't entirely sure about Alanna, because she tells Perrin to watch himself with her. Verin probably knows more than we, but likely not all. In regards to Alanna disappearing twice in the Two Rivers...
Well, I really don't believe this myself, but Slayer is of course running around somewhere there so... Maybe some connection there? I just can't see how that would work out with the 'not betraying Rand' part.
More thoughts coming up.
3
Daishan: 2002-12-02
Oh and another one:
I think it was Egwene who remarked that:
"some Aes Sedae who shouldn't know about Rand show too much interest in him. Elaida, for one, and Alanna Mosvani." I think I remember her saying something like this when she comes to the Tower in book 3. Another clue. And it's true as well; how can she know about Rand? Verin never told her; she asks Perrin if 'the shepherd hold the sword', but she makes sure she never talks about Rand that way in front of Alanna. Yet Alanna asks about Rand almost as soon as Perrin arrives... Where does she get her information? Is it possible she's a Darkfriend who will repent later on? Like Ingtar? That way she wouldn't betray Rand, and she could also be the 'Darkfriend close to Rand'. Of course this is all wild speculation, but my point was;
Alanna has too much interest in Rand and she shouldn't know about him yet.
4
silverwolf: 2002-12-28
Alanna's already starting to play a larger part--Rand sent her to deal with the Tairan rebels in Haddon Mirk. I don't know how this ties into everything, but I'd bet it's important.
5
Daishan: 2003-01-11
Agree about that.
And another thing; after rereading the bonding-scene, I do not think Verin compulsed her to do it. Actually Verin thinks to herself (quote) "Very likely it had been frustration over that (not bonding Perrin because of Faile threatening her), plus the frayed state of her nerves, that had led to what she did with Rand. Not only bonding him, but doing so without his permission. That had not been done in hundreds of years."
This literally states Verin's beliefs over what led Alanna to bond Rand, and it doesn't include compulsion...
6
Great Lord of the Dark: 2003-02-25
At the time Alanna bonds Rand, he holds Cairhien, Tear and Caemlyn, and has brought a massive army across the Dragonwall. Moiraine, the only Aes Sedai close to him is dead (does he tell Verin and Alanna, or would they have heard by then?). There are no checks against Rand's growing power, and with news of the rift in the Tower, Alanna knows that Rand might slip through the White Tower's hands if they are preoccupied with their civil war.'
Alanna knows she has a unique opportunity to get close to him, and impulsively, she takes it. Why? She is a borderlander, has grown up fighting the Shadow, probably has dreams of fighting the Shadow to her death. She chose Green, after all. Bonding Rand on the spot seems like the only shot the Tower will have of gaining influence over Rand, before he gets too powerful or arrogant. She is helping him by giving him Warder stamina. (Do the effects increase since he's bonded three times over now?). Plus, Perrin just slipped through her fingers. She's realized that two of the three ta'veren she set out to learn more about are rocking events throughout the world. No, she doesn't have a choice in the bonding, she has to do it, for the Greens, for the Tower, for the World.
The most suspicious thing about her is her journey to the Two Rivers. She and Verin must have set out right after Egwene and company left the Tower hunting the Black Ajah. Verin had now met all five of the Emond's Fielders, and must have suspected she could find or use something there. Rand himself took anyone who could channel, down to the roosters. So she mentions to Alanna (whose desires she knows well) that she is going to the Two Rivers, and Alanna jumps at the chance to see where the three ta'veren come from, maybe to try find more, or learn ways to gain influence on them. That Rand, Mat and Perrin were ta'veren was common knowledge inside the Tower.
So there's rhyme and reason to everything she does, if you take her behaviour at face value. No Compulsion, no Black Ajah, just Alanna being Alanna and Verin taking advantage of it. Why? In case Verin wants to get out of there someone would be there to protect whatever they bring out of the Two Rivers, maybe also suspecting what Alanna was capable of, and knowing that strings needed to be tied to the ta'veren. Nothing Alanna has done in later books indicates nefarious schemes, just a desire to tie the ta'veren to the White Tower, protect her Warder, the Dragon Reborn, fight Tarmon Gai'don, and obliterate the Shadow.
But I'll admit I don't have ideas on why she disappeared twice in the Two Rivers. Finding Channelers? Interviewing Tam? Searching Rand's house? Talking to Ordeith? Slayer? The Great Lord of the Dark? Killing Trollocs? Catching forty winks? Just trying to escape Verin's oversight and find something on her own? Argh! Who knows. My bet is getting background info on the ta'veren without letting Verin know, since they're only supposed to be there to find young women who can channel.
7
Weird Harold: 2003-03-21
First of all, I basically agree with Great Lord; Alanna's mysterious behavior is just Alanna being Alanna although I have some different thoughts on just exactly what motivates Alanna. I think Alanna is much simpler to understand if the very sparse hints about her background is considered.
Note: I've broken paragraphs down in the quotes and taken parts out of sequence here. I tried not to distort your meanings too much in the process.
I think Siuan's cryptic comment about "funny ideas of Honor" does have some meaning.
Unfortunately, there are only Five definite Arafellins we can use to gather information on national characteristics from, and they're all rather special people. -- The king, His Wife, Two advisors, and his sister, Kiruna Sedai.
Vandene, Andeleas and Jaim, Vandene's warder, retire to a town in Arafela, but it's never stated any of them are actually Arafellin born and raised.
I think the only one who can really give any clues to Alanna's motivations is Kiruna Sedai, who is also Green Ajah and has four warders. Kiruna is relevant because she is a logical role model or competitor for Alanna:
1: She's an Arafellin Princess
2: She is a Senior Green Ajah sister, both by age and Power
3: She has Twice as many warders
Alanna is apparently fairly young, as Aes Sedai go -- the Encyclopedia WOT site give her year of birth as 963 NE, or 37 by the time of WH.
{I know there is some debate about her age, mostly in conjunction with trying to determine Verin's age, but I'll use this one for the sake of a common point of reference.}
So, Alanna's actions can be tested against the hypothesis of an ambitious young Arafellin Green sister from common roots testing herself against the achievements of a social and Aes Sedai superior. I find her actions can fit this model, but not quite perfectly. It is a different approach to understanding her and may have some value
Alanna is presented as being in search of another warder -- a ta'veren is her first choice, but she needs Five warders to best Kiruna's four. In many ways, she's depicted as desperate to acquire more warders although the focus is on her interest in the ta'veren.
Green Ajah are reputed to often be "close" to their warders -- closer than might be proper. Her two disappearances might be no more than arranging and then keeping a liaison with a potential new Warder. No need to mask the bond for making the arrangements, but definitely a need to mask it for the actual rendezvous.
By the way, even the bonding is only a means to an end; she wanted to control Rand. Since she found out she couldn't do it through the bond, wouldn't she try something else? Well, that's it for me. If anybody thinks I'm talking nonsense, please let me know so I don't have to lay awake at night anymore :-)
One vital point is usually overlooked about Alanna's mental state when she bonded Rand: Her Warder, Owein, was killed in the Two Rivers! The WOT Chronology site gives the time lapse between his death and bonding Rand as 144 days -- just over five WOT months.
The death of a Warder is far more than "fray nerves" of the Aes Sedai involved. I suspect that the breaking of a warder bind by death causes physical as well as emotional changes -- probably hormonal changes. I can't recall any detailed accounts of the effects, but they include mood swings, crying jags, and last for about a year at minimum. Every Aes Sedai who loses a warder is affected differently, but those symptoms seem to be common to all of them, and all are a bit crazy for quite some time.
I don't think the combination of wanting ta'veren warders, the emotional and physical turmoil of losing Owein, and Rand's ta'veren effect, gave Alanna any choice at all in Bonding Rand.
Alanna had a desire to bond Rand, Perrin, Mat, or all three when she went to the Two Rivers to bring her total to five warders including three ta'veren -- now wouldn't THAT just show she was better than Kiruna?
Faile thwarted her plans for Perrin -- both by marrying him and threatening to kill Alanna if she tried it -- but her "casual" question about Mat just before she bonded Rand suggests she still had designs on him as well.
I think the only effect Rand's Ta'veren effect had was to make her bond him without permission.
The Great Lord's observation about Borderlander commitment to Duty and such is probably additional motivation, but I think ambition and rivalry played at least as much in her motivations.
In her conversation with Rand in WH, she refuses to transfer the Bond unless he can prove to her that the person receiving it could take care of him as well as she could. I think her attitude there is part of the explanation for the bond in the first place, and an indication that her arrogance on this point goes beyond normal Aes Sedai arrogance. She seems determined to convince Rand (and herself) that there is *No one* who is better at caring for warders than she is -- an attitude very typical of someone trying to prove she's better than someone else.
At that point, Verin had met three very strong ta'veren and two of the strongest channelers in years, all of them from one tiny out of the way village. Any Aes Sedai who knew what Verin knew, especially any Brown Sister, would head to the Two Rivers to investigate as quickly as possible. Alanna's inclusion was simply because she already knew about the Emond's Fielders, so Verin didn't have to explain or convince someone else to tag along.
Alanna has too much interest in Rand and she shouldn't know about him yet.
Tamyrlin, "being an independent" is the secret Fourth Oath -- it's part of the job description for an Aes Sedai. Virtually *every* Aes Sedai is an "independent" unless specifically constrained by the pecking order. Even then, the independent operations are only put on hold unless specifically forbidden by someone she can't disobey -- like the Amyrlin's direct orders.
Aes Sedai knowing things they aren't supposed to is a staple of the WOT universe, and no stranger in Alanna than in any other Aes Sedai.
In fact, immediately after bonding Rand, she tells him, "I said I would not harm you. I have done exactly the opposite."
I think the four-fold bonding does increase the Stamina effect, but not in a simple "four Bonds" = "Four times the stamina increase" ratio. It's a unique situation, but I don't think it's simply additive.
One point towards Alanna's importance to Rand -- Would he have survived Padan Fain's cut at the Rebel Camp without the Warder Bond to slow the effect of the Ruby Dagger until Damer Flinn could treat it?
That one incident alone makes Alanna and the Bond important to the story without any further involvement.
8
Daishan: 2003-03-24
Just to keep nitpicking;
We still don't know why Alanna disappeared twice in the Two Rivers. Of course she could just be crying about Owein...
But I believe she shouldn't have known about Rand before she went to the Two Rivers, and if she did then Verin told her, which is very unlikely because Verin doesn't fully trust her...
9
Weird Harold: 2003-03-24
Re: Alanna's Fishy Little Scheme
Just to keep nitpicking;
We still don't know why Alanna disappeared twice in the Two Rivers. Of course she could just be crying about Owein...
Alanna's first appearance is as part of the Amyrlin's entourage at Fal Dara. If nothing else, the respect and deference shown a "Backwater Rube" like Rand would pique her curiosity. There were many people who knew parts of Rand's secret that she could have put together.
Since the never revealed secret handbook on "How to be an Aes Sedai" isprobably subtled, "You to can be a nosy arrogant witch and keep secrets from everyone," nothing ANY Aes Sedai knows that she shouldn't will never surprise me. There is no logical reason that Verin has to be the source of her information and there are too many other possibilities to make any connection.
Verin's mistrust of Alanna just might indicate that the trip to Two Rivers was originally Alanna' Idea and Verin is just the tagalong who took over.
10
Ashaman Ragsdale: 2003-07-22
Is it at all possible that Verin used compulsion on Alanna influencing her to bond Rand against his will?
11
Tamyrlin: 2003-07-23
I think it is possible that Verin influenced Alanna during the time that she was mourning her dead warder, encouraging her to do something.
12
Jiana: 2003-07-23
Just to make a belated point:
Verin was not sure, at the time of Rand's bonding, what had happened to Moiraine. Verin believed her to be dead, but was not 100% certain, and definitely did not know the circumstances.
Also, IIRC, from New Spring we have another Arafellin character reference. Reyn, I believe his name was, who traveled with Bukama & Lan... But then he turned out to be a Darkfriend... and wait, wasn't he Malkieri by birth? Oh well, I guess that led nowhere. :p
13
Mairashda: 2003-07-23
"Very likely it had been frustration over that, plus the frayed state of her nerves, that had let to what she (Alanna) did with Rand. Not only bonding him, but doing so without his permission."
(LoC, Ch.11)
Had Verin compulsed Alanna to bond Rand, why should she want to speculate about Alanna's motivation? (Unless, of course, Lanfear compulsed Verin to compulse Alanna)
14
The Leveler: 2003-07-23
I think Allana could control Rand through the bond, it just is very hard and may not always work.
15
Priest: 2003-07-23
Leveler, Alanna can't compel (control) Rand through the bond.
(Blatently stolen from one of Callandor's posts)
From LoC:
**"If you had to bond a man without asking him," Kiruna demanded in that commanding voice, "why, by the Light most holy, have you not used the bond to bend him to you will? Compared to the other, that is only slapping his wrist."
Alanna still had small control of her emotions. Color actually flooded her cheeks, partly in anger by the way her eyes flashed, and assuredly partly in shame. "Has no one told you?" she asked, too brightly. "I suppose no one wants to think of it. I certainly do not." Faeldrin and Seonid looked at the floor, and they were not the only ones. "I tried to compel him moments after I bonded him," Alanna continued as if noticing none of it. "Have you ever attempted to uproot an oak tree with your bare hands, Kiruna? It was much the same."
...
"No one has ever bonded a man who can channel," Alanna said with her mirth subsided. "Perhaps that has something to do with it."**
I believe that it is almost impossible to compel a man who can channel through the bond.
16
Murrin: 2003-09-23
We have it from Sammael that no man can be Compelled in any way while holding the Power - Rand seizes Saidin as soon as the bonding ends.
17
Zarine: 2004-05-05
I think Both Alanna and Verin have their own little scheme going on. THey have a plan between them, but they also have plans the other doesn't know about. Although we don't know exactly what these plans are at the moment, I think there isn't much more than that to it. End of story.
18
davood: 2004-11-26
Zarine....
That quote makes me think that alanna perhaps did lie by telling rand she would not do anything to hurt him when she bonded him, because she intended to compel him to do things..........
I can only imagine where that would have led.
19
steve nebraska: 2004-11-30
davood
Are you implying that Alanna is black ajah? If she lied about harming Rand she would have to be black.
