ha'rah and the DO vs. Creator
by anderwarrick: 2003-06-07 | Not yet rated
“From time to time he idly stroked on of the two mindtraps that hung on plain silken cords around his neck. At his touch , the blood-red crystal of the cour'souvra pulse, swirls moving in endless depths like the beating of a heart. His real attention was on the game laid out before him on the table, thirty-three red pieces and thirty-three green arrayed across a playing surface of thirteen squares by thirteen. A re-creation of the early stages of a famous game. The most important piece, the Fisher, black and white like the playing surface, still waited in it's starting place on the central square. A complex game, sha'rah, ancient long before the War of Power. Sha'rah, tcheran, and no'ri, the game now called simple “stones,” each had adherents who claimed it encompassed all the subtleties of life, but Moridin had always favored sha'rah. Only nine people living even remembered the game. He had been a master of it. Much more complex than tcheran or no'ri. The first object was capture of the Fisher. Only then did the game truly begin.”, tPoD Prologue(Pages 33-34)
“The Fisher held his attention, baiting him. Several pieces had varying moves, but only the Fisher's attributes altered according to where it stood; on a white square, weak in attack yet agile and far-ranging in escape; on black, strong in attack but slow and vulnerable. When masters played, the Fisher changed sides many times before the end. The green-and-red goal-row that surrounded the playing surface could be threatened by any piece, but only the Fisher could move onto it. Not that he was safe, even there; the Fisher was never safe. When the Fisher was yours, you tried to move him to a square of your color behind your opponent's end of the board. That was victory, the easiest way, but not the only one. When your opponent held the Fisher, you attempted to leave him no choice for the Fisher but to move onto your color. Anywhere at all along the goal-row would do; holding the Fisher could be more dangerous than not. Of course, there was a third path to victory in sha'rah, if you took it before letting yourself get trapped. The game always degenerated in a bloody melee, then, victory coming only with complete annihilation of your enemy. He had tried that once, in desperation, but the attempt had failed. Painfully.”, tPoD Prologue(Page 35)
“The Fisher was always worked as a man, a bandage blinding his eyes and one hand pressed to his side, a few drops of blood dripping through his fingers. The reasons, like the source of the name, were lost in the mist of time.”, tPoD Prologue(Page 35)
First lets look at the game of Sha'rah. There are two players and then the Fisher. I think that the two players represent the DO and the Creator, while the Fisher is the Dragon. First of all, the light's champion has been turned to the DO, but he didn't win and break out of his prison even then. This leads me to believe that Rand = Fisher is even more probable. “The first object was capture of the Fisher. Only then did the game truly begin.” That means that even if the DO gets control of Rand, the DO still hasn't won. The light could just get him back, according to this line: “When your opponent held the Fisher, you attempted to leave him no choice for the Fisher but to move onto your color. Anywhere at all along the goal-row would do;”
With the different attributes depending on where the Fisher is, it could mean how Rand reacts differently when he is somewhere, choosing to run or fight instead of the other. “When masters played, the Fisher changed sides many times before the end.” The big sha'rah board, the pattern, is played on by the DO and the Creator. The Fisher has changed sides many times apparently, since both must be ‘master players.'
Then there's the part where Moridin says, “He had tried that once, in desperation, but the attempt had failed. Painfully,” in relation to destroying all the enemy's pieces. I think that that's what happened in the AoL, that the DO tried to just destroy all the Creators ‘pieces,' but failed, thus him being sealed in his prison.
Then there is this part where he says, “A complex game, sha'rah, ancient long before the War of Power.” I think that he doesn't mean the game in itself for men, but that it is the struggle between the DO and Creator that is ancient, which it is.
With all the quotes and similarities, it leads me to believe that sha'rah is a game that was made in relation to the struggle between the Creator and the DO.
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1
Tamyrlin: 2003-06-12
I think the mention of how painful it was has to do with Moridin trying to just kill Rand in TDR, and failing painfully. Instead, he wants to use Rand more strategically this time, forcing him along the path, giving Rand no choices. But I do agree, this game is supposed to be symbolic of the struggle between Good and Evil. And Moriding points out, it always turns into a bloody melee anyway, which will happen at Shayol Ghul.
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Callandor: 2003-06-12
Agreed. Direct comparison between the Light and Dark forces, the Fisher being Rand, and Moridins painful failure being him of course dying in TDR when he tried to coax Rand and then fled and battled and then of course got run through by Callandor.
3
Rand-althor: 2003-06-12
Tamyrlin, i believe you have that passage wrong. He says "Of course, there was a third path to victory in sha'rah, if you took it before letting yourself get trapped. The game always degenerated in a bloody melee, then, victory coming only with complete annihilation of your enemy. He had tried that once, in desperation, but the attempt had failed. Painfully.”, tPoD Prologue i have always taken this to mean that it always becomes a bloddy meele, with the only way to victory complete annihaltion when you go for an all out attack, and chuck strategy out the window.
4
rubbernilly: 2003-06-12
2 opinions:
1) I don't think the Dragon has ever served the Shadow. Otherwise, he would have been marked and re-incarnated by the DO into a new body as needed. Never mind the fact that Rand states he knows definitively that in a thousand lifetimes he has never served the DO, and never mind the fact that we know that the DO is the father of lies.
2) The game only becomes a bloody mess if the strategy of annihilation is attempted. Not every game gets to that bloody mess stage, according to Moridin.
But I do agree that the time that he remembers where he tried to simply kill off his opponents pieces refers to the fight with Rand in Tear.
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solomonrex: 2003-06-12
It's only bloody if you follow the melee strategy of eliminating all the other person's units. However, what's interesting here is an indictment of Moridin's own words- of statement of his eternal place on the wheel as the flip side of the Dragon. There is no Moridin piece on this game board.
6
Weird Harold: 2003-06-12
About that "Third Option":
"Anywhere at all along the goal-row would do; holding the Fisher could be more dangerous than not. Of course, there was a third path to victory in sha'rah, if you took it before letting yourself get trapped. The game always degenerated in a bloody melee, then, victory coming only with complete annihilation of your enemy. He had tried that once, in desperation, but the attempt had failed. Painfully"
Option One: YOU Control the Fisher and maneuver him to a winning square.
Option two: Your OPPONENT controls the Fisher and you leave him no options.
Option Three: Oops, accidently killed the Fisher and he can't be moved anywhere.
The Third path to victory is when neither side controls the Fisher or the Fisher is removed from play.
That's why the Aelfinn told Rand, "to live you must die." Moridin is shaping the game so that the Third Path which must be taken before "you let yourself get trapped" is less endless possible. If the Fisher is suddenly taken out of play -- i.e. Rand "dies" -- then everything Moridin has done up to that point becomes exactly the WRONG thing to have done. He's out of position for the Third Path and it's the only one left.
Once Moridin (or the DO) passed the point in the developmental stages where the Third Path has a realistic, if bloody, chance for success, the order to "Let the Lord of chaos rule," went out and was enforced.
With the Cleansing of the Taint, The Third Path is again a viable way to win from the current positions of the pieces, so Rand again becomes "expendable" even though steering him to a win for the Dark Player is till preferable and possible, although capturing him is no longer an option.
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Callandor: 2003-06-12
The Fisher being on the opponents side could easily be Rand doing what the Shadow wants, so in theory he is of the Shadow then just unknowingly. THe same goes for when he is forced to do what the Shadow wants.
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scion2: 2003-06-13
I don't think that the Dragon (or Rand) would ever knowingly work for the DO. Perhaps the reference to the Fischer (Rand) belonging to Moridin merely denotes Rand being sucked into doing what the DO want because there is no other option.
9
Rand alThor15: 2003-06-15
"His real attention was on the game laid out before him on the table, thirty-three red pieces and thirty-three green arrayed across a playing surface of thirteen squares by thirteen" - anderwarrick
thirteen...hmm..doesn't that ring a bell??? and the fisher switching sides??? thirteen channelers, thirteent fades....the fisher switches sides...this may not be a simple coincidence.
10
Rand alThor15: 2003-06-17
My dear anderwarrick... here is the quote which will put an end to your theory, i just found it now, so sorry tam for having to post two times in a row...here it is :
"Blood and wine dripped from his gashed hand, unnoticed. Perhaps the Fisher did come from a dim remnant of memory of Rand al'Thor, the shadow of a shadow. It did not matter. He realized he was laughing, and made no effort to stop. On the board, the Fisher stood waiting. but in the greater game, al'Thor moved already to his wishes." - Proloque of The Path of Daggers.
You just had to urn the page to get the answer.
11
Anubis: 2003-07-19
13 forsaken, 13 fades, 13 women in a link... so 13 is an important number, what of it?
12
Callandor: 2003-07-20
Trinities, sevens, thirteens, and multiples are often common numbers in fantasy series.
13
Friar: 2003-07-21
I have always agreed that the game is a representation of the struggle between DO and the creator. But thanks for posting it anderwarrick. However, I believe that the reference to:
“Of course, there was a third path to victory in sha'rah, if you took it before letting yourself get trapped.”
Is a reference to Lewis putting the seals on the DO. The DO's counter stroke was then launched. Trying to annihilate his enemies but after he was (re)trapped along with the forsaken= failure.
The last comments of Weird Harold are fascinating in reference to modern day Randworld especially when you compare them to various references to phrases that the forsaken make to DO changing his “truths” from one day to the next.
Finaly, if we can believe the quote "When masters played, the Fisher changed sides many times before the end" Notice “changed sides” and not controlled, then there a way to change the Fisher/Rand from dark to light. Intresting!
14
Mizguidded Khild: 2003-07-21
It talks about the game Moridin had set up on his board as being the early stages of a famous game. The most famous "game" would be between the Creator and the DO, using the Dragon. One thing to remember is LTT/Rand are only human, and as humans flirt the line between good and evil, though they may side with one side more than another. While LTT/Rand are primarily good, they may have done bad things thus working for the dark, or allowed things to happen that aided what the dark wanted done. Thus the Fisher altering sides.
What also made me wonder is that though the board is 13x13 each side has 33 "players", and he mentions that the game has already started, for what he was looking at was a recreation of the early stages of the famous game. So what I am wondering is if since the game is already in play, have any pieces been removed, as in the players dying, or if the game starts out with an odd number of players such as that.
15
moridin68: 2003-07-22
I am a new member, so please forgive me if I bring anything to the table that has been mentioned before.
I think that the comparison between sha'rah and the struggle between light and dark could possibly describe a time before the Age of Legends.
Before the Bore was opened in the DO's prison, humanity had never heard of the DO or war. Perhaps the successful imprisonment w/o the use of seals was the one attempt Moridin/DO tried to use the third path to victory. What could possibly be more painful to the DO than to be sealed away without anyone even sensing its presence, or trying to free him ?
Just a thought from a youngling.
16
mako0424: 2004-11-08
Just a quick few ideas and interjections. I think the answers to many questions of Wheel of Time are philosophical in nature, and this game represents this battle to the fullest extent.
Ok, first off, i agree, that obviously Rand is the Fisher and the Fisher is equally white and black to represent man's and thus Rand's moral nature in being possibly bad or good, even at the same time.
I also would believe that the Fisher can be on a black square, ie be helping the Dark One without any knowledge, intent, or idea that that is so. I also think the 33 players are people we have met and know already. For example, Moiraine, Lan, Elayne, Perrin, Mat, Thom, Faile, Berelain, any major player on that side, and the dark players consist of the Forsaken, Lady Shiale, Doilan Mellar, etc.
These players are all quintessential on each side, and some may already be dead.
I also belive that Moridin was referring to himself and his strategy in TDR when he tried to go after Rand, Perrin, Mat and everyone at once and obliterate them from the beginning and this failed miserably (ie. his death, resulting in painful loss).
I also think The Dragon has turned to the Dark One in previous lives, and i think this Age is the crucial one. Hence the reason the Fisher so accuartely represents Rand, ie. wounded side, and bandage on eyes, which hasnt happened, but has been forseen.
I would say this game stems from the main battle where either the Dark One perrishes for good, or the good guys are beat forever, or at least until a few Ages go by.
I would also say the back line of each side represents the Final Battle. it only matters then which way Rands goes, and its gonna be very close, an inner moral battle for Rand to decide which way. (even though we all have an idea which way hes going to go right) hes gonna surprise everyone, and swiftly execute the Dark One for good.
