ain Farstrider was able to channel!
by Anaiyella: 2003-11-10 | Not yet rated
Hey everybody,
Now, I know that a lot of us belive that Jain farstrider is the old guy in book # 7 or 8 that Matt meets up with. Well in the first book at the eye of the world, when Rand is confronted with Ba'alzamon, it reads "'Jain Farstrider, a hero,' he twisted the word to a sneer, 'whom I painted like a fool and sent to the Ogier thinking he was free of me.'". Now remember that this is Ba'alzamon trying to convince Rand that he has had control over all the events that have taken place, with Rand escaping his traps. Well, I believe that when he said he sent Jain Farstrider to the Ogiers, it meant that Jain Farstrider went there to escape him.
Now we know that the Ogier live in stedding, and that channeling cannot happen in a stedding. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think that Jain Farstrider could channel and that's why he went to a stedding. Now I know some of you are thinking "what a bunch or rubish, if he could channel he would have gone mad, or he would still be able to channel at least, and he sure isn't channeling much around Matt.", but what if Jain Farstrider was stilled, or burnt him self out. This would explain why he hasn't gone insane, and why he doesn't channel. It also would explain why he could still be alive. I mean Jain Farstrider was alive during the breaking of the world how could he be alive still unless he aged a lot slower. This is another reason why I think it is posible that he might have been able to channel before. Anyways thats my theory, maybe I'm wrong, or maybe I'm right, just let me know what you all think.
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1
Tamyrlin: 2003-11-15
I don't think we can definitively say either way, but it is an interesting thought. However, why do you believe that Jain was alive during the Breaking of the World (did I miss something?) There is a quote, "Breyan fled with her infant son Isam, and was run down by Trollocs as she rode south with him. No one knows their fate of a certainty, but it can be guessed. I can find pity only for the boy. When Cowin Fairheart's treachery was revealed and he was taken by young Jain Charin - already called Jain Farstrider - when Fairheart was brought to the Seven Towers in chains, the Great Lords called for his head on a pike. But because he had been second only to al'Akir and Lain in the hearts of the people, the King faced him in single combat and slew him. Al'Akir wept when he killed Cowin. Some say he wept for a friend who had given himself to the Shadow, and some say for Malkier." Jain Farstrider is old, but not that old. He is a hero of sorts, "The Travels of Jain Farstrider", so it would be interesting if he had help (channeling) in his travels, beyond normal skills or talents. It might also explain why Ishamael was interested in him and was able to find and manipulate him. You could even suggest that the Gholam detected the presence of Saidin, from Noal, which is why he leaves Mat alone - "He's down this alley!" a man shouted. "Follow me! Hurry! He'll get away!" Mat kept his eyes on the gholam. Its gaze flickered beyond him, toward the street, and it hesitated. "I am ordered to avoid notice, save by those I harvest," it spat at him, "so you will live a little longer. A little longer."
2
Rand-althor: 2003-11-15
It said he came into the stedding sick or mad(I forget which) and that with time in the stedding he got better. That can't have been through channeing, or, as RJ has said before, he would not have gotten better. Also if he could channel, then Ba'alzamon would have gotten 13 channelers and 13 fades and made him a DF, in which case he wouldn't want to escape BaA
3
Callandor: 2003-11-15
**, but what if Jain Farstrider was stilled, or burnt him self out. This would explain why he hasn't gone insane, and why he doesn't channel. It also would explain why he could still be alive.**
Really doubtful. Stilled women and gentled men and burned out men and women all lose the will to live (the depression that kills you). They are recorded to live about 2 years. Look at how Logain was going before he found something to live for enough to last till he got Healed. Farstrider would be dead for a long time, unless he found something that could fill that need.
**I mean Jain Farstrider was alive during the breaking of the world how could he be alive still unless he aged a lot slower.**
As Tam said, where the heck did you get that? Farstrider captured Cowin Gemallan Fairheart around 955 NE, and he would be about 20 at the latest, 968 NE he publishes "The Travels of Jain Farstrider" and in 981 he disappears from view. Where the heck is the need to be a channeler to be that old? He is about 65 now by this logic; the fact that he appears old kills the entire point of him being a channeler since channeling men DO slow the same as women, just at different ages (women is about 20-25, men is about 25-30).
4
Zaela Sedai: 2003-11-15
I'm going to have to disagree on this one, presuming that Noal = Farstrider. (since that's what I believe) If farstider could channel he wouldn't look so old. As Callandor said, he's in his 60s. He'd still look about 30 if he could channel. Even if he was alive at the breaking(which isn't the case) that was 3000 years ago. Channelers only live for about 750 years.
RJ obviously mentions Jain Farstrider many times to make us remember him. Most likely for a reason which is why it makes sense that he = Noal. The gholam seems to leave because hears someone coming, not because he senses someone coming.
5
Sensir: 2003-11-15
If you think he could live the 1000 years its been since the breaking cause hes aged slower i think your wrong. But he may have for some reason put in a stasis box or like the forsaken he could have been heald close to the creator and it may have slowed his aging?? but why would such a powerful hero be able to channel that would ruin him beign a hero wouldnt it??? no one trusts male aes sedai
6
Shadar Darei: 2003-11-15
Even if Farstrider was able to channel and went to go live in a stedding he would never have left (however in the guide to WoT it says men would eventually leave the stedding thinking the source was clean or out of longing). Like the rest of the world he could probably never fathom the male half of the source being cleansed. Even if he found out somehow he must have left the stedding before the source was cleansed because he meets Mat before it happens.
Of course you could throw all that out the window and say that he was shielded from the taint beforehand somehow like the Chosen, but thats really unlikely.
7
EvilJawa101: 2003-11-15
With regard's to farstriders channleing, I can't say one way or another, although I personally doubt it. The one point I do think should be noted is that, of all the heros of the horn, the one i hear mentioned the most was farstridder. Whenever someone picks up a book, just to read, it seems to be The Travels of Jain Farstridder. Soooo, I find it slightly odd that when Mat blew the horn, none of the heros mentioned were Jain Farstridder, meaning, Jain is most likely alive.
8
wolfbrother369: 2003-11-15
Here's an idea.
Ishmael is trying to convince Rand that he controls all events and manipulates them to his will so their is no point in resisting.
This is when Rand makes it to the eye of the World just in time.
Ishmael/Moriden considers himself a great tactician (stones player)
Now suppose in Book One the Man that Loial speaks of coming to a Stedding 20 odd years ago was Jain Farstrider.
(EotW, Ch. 42 Rememberance of Dreams)
"... There was a man came to Stedding Shangtai a little time back. This was not unusual in itself, at the time, since a many refugees had come to the Spine of World fleeing what you humans call the Aiel War. ... He was at the point of death, though there was no wound or mark on him. The Elders thought it might be something Aes Sedai had done ... since as soon as was within the stedding he quickley got well. A few months. One night he left without a word to anyone, simply sneaked away when the moon was down. ... Before he left, he told a curious tale which he said he meant to carry to Tar Valon. He said the Dark One intended to blind the Eye of the World, and slay the Great Serpent, kill time itself. ..."
Now what if Jain somehow found out about the plans for the eye of the world. What if he was pursued by Darkfriends and black ajah into stedding Shangtai. Now this would account for
1. The strange illness with no mark that quickley got better when entering the stedding.
2. What ishmael meant by Jain Farstrider escaping him into the stedding. Since black Ajah (not being able to channel) or any creature of the dark wouldn't want to enter.
Now what if Ishmael considering himself a great tactician either let JF escape under the guise of a half-hearted pursuit, or atleast he wants Rand to believe so, in order to eventually draw rand into a trap at the EotW.
9
Anubis: 2003-11-16
erm... ishmael can channel maybe thats why he went. also i be wonderin if the true power works in stedding. somthing to consider.
10
Anubis: 2003-11-16
oh and jain is not a "Hero of the Horn" hes just a hero... he may become a hero of the horn.. but is not one yet.
11
Zaela Sedai: 2003-11-16
I doubt that the TP can be used in a stedding, for one they're too pure and have been said to be almost like another world within this world. If the TP could be used, they probably would have been destroyed already.
12
ranman38: 2003-11-17
Very slightly off topic, but has anyone considered that it was Noal/Jain that was the half dead man that went to the Stedding and told Loial about the DO's plan to blind the eye of the world?
13
Cor Shan: 2003-11-17
Yes, we know that old man in Stedding is Jain. It has been _3000_ years since breaking. Also, I thought that burnt-out peoples lived longer than Severed.... like Setalle Anan, who was burnt, rather than Logain. Besides, why would Jain be alive at the breaking??? He is 60. it is in the chapter before they set out to th Eye in tEotW.
14
wolfbrother369: 2003-11-19
People who are severed (stilled or burned out)do live longer in the sense that all that time that they had been channeling they aged slower. If they can live through the depression. But once they are severed they start aging at a normal pace, I beleive.
15
Zaela Sedai: 2003-11-19
We only know that he's an old man and he dissapered in 981NE after returing from the blight. Where's the qoute that he's 60? I couldn't find it.
And while searching, I came across the fact that he may have gone to Shayol Ghul
TITLE: Eye of the World, CHAPTER: GLOSSARY
"Farstrider, Jain (JAY-ihn): A hero of the northern lands who journeyed to many lands and had many adventures; the author of several books, as well as being the subject of books and stories. He vanished in 981 NE, after returning from a trip into the Great Blight which some said had taken him all the way to Shayol Ghul"
Any theories on why and what he did that for?
16
Callandor: 2003-11-19
**We only know that he's an old man and he dissapered in 981NE after returing from the blight. Where's the qoute that he's 60?**
He captured Cowain in 955 NE, he was at least 20 to do that and it is the year 1000 NE right now. So he is around 65.
17
Cor Shan: 2003-11-19
No, I meant that a Burnt out person lives longer THAN a severed one. Well, both will live longer than a normal person in all likelyhood, but a burntout lives longer because they cannot sence the souce, they cannot see the weaves, ect. but a severed person can see, feel and all that.
Think of it like two starbing peoples:
The Burnout is a rich person whom is thrown onto the street. They find some food, and can ward off death
The Stilled/Gentled one, is the exact same, only they are staring through a glass wall at a huge feast. They keep staring until they die.
18
Rand alThor15: 2003-11-20
I like your comparison Cor Shan...i don't think Jain could channel...or else there ould be more clues seeing how much he is mentioned..maybe soemthing like : :something strange happened in front of Jain, it seemed as thou he is doing it, but no normal man is capable fo such a thing" and Rand would mention it...or somewhen else..whatever...there would be more clues..
19
Him-who-may: 2003-11-22
Heres summit to think about.
Jain MUST still be alive somewhere otherwise surely he must have become a hero of the horn and been present at Falme.
This of course sheds no light whether he is good/evil or if it is Noal but given how often he is mentioned I think its likley that PJ wants to include the character somehow and its a bit late to be adding new mainstream characters now isn't it?
20
Zaela Sedai: 2003-11-22
I think that RJ had always intended on having Noal/Farstrider (if in fact they are one in the same) in th story. That book was always being talked about or lying around or something. He made sure we knew who farstrider was. RJ talked less about hawkwing it seems!:) So I don't think he is trying to throw in a major character this late in the game.
21
aeruphus: 2004-01-28
This may sound a little crazy, I don't know if it has been discussed, but I always thought Thom was actually jain farstrider. He seems like a good candidate. First of all, who was he to win the love of morgase, no easy feat. Yeah court bard and all, that just doesnt seem to be all that wonderful. And he knows way more than what he should.
22
Mairashda: 2004-01-28
Thom is in his fifties. Jain farstrider was a young man around that time (remeber, he did play some role in capturing cowin fairhart just before the fall of malkier). no, it just does not scan.
oh...and: why does everybody have to be able to channel!?
23
Callandor: 2004-01-28
Thom never tells story from Shara, and we know Farstrider went there. Jain does.
24
Mairashda: 2004-01-29
"that time"= the time around Thoms birth.
oops...
25
sung-wood: 2004-02-12
I'm not sure where the idea came from that Jain Fartstrider was around during the Breaking because when Cowin betrayed Malkier and Breyan fled with her infant son Isam was also when Lan was a baby. Farstrider later captures Cowin Fairheart the Darkfriend and is therefore is around when Malkier falls and Lan is smuggled out with his bodyguards. Jain would be an old man at this point (the end of Crossroads). Jain Farstrider (Charin) = Noal Charin. He was the old man outside of Carridin's residence in Ebou Dar unable to remember things about himself...as for being able to channel is to be seen as of yet. He seems to disappear all of the time but by being in Mat's company would the silver foxhead alert Mat of saidin being used by Noal.
26
Khaos: 2004-02-12
I don't think he can. Although its almost certain he went to the Ogier to escape whatever influence Ishamael had on him, there is simply no evidence that he can or could channel.
His adventures would be more indicative that Jain was Ta'veran although not as strongly as rand and party.
Noal is almost certainly Farstrider if for no other reason that Mat is the only one of the main characters whom we know has not read The travels of Jain Farstrider so RJ logic dictates that he be the one to meet him.
27
Balwer: 2004-04-20
taking the idea a little further, maybe Noal was one of Lan's escorts out of Malkier, and later went off, so Lan will recognize him as Jain Farstrider.
28
charliec: 2004-04-21
the only ones of Lan's escort to survive were those who raised him... and besides Jain Farstrider was already at large by then :)
29
Anubis: 2004-04-21
i wonder if the true power can be used in steddings, i would say no but would not be all that suprised to see it go either way.
this whole jain can channel is kinda like saying artur hawkwing could channel. no evidence for or against. i perfer to err on the side of no. if RJ had wanted us to think he had channeled then there would be hints or evidence.
30
Yaga Shura: 2005-02-16
I don't believe JAin FArstrider could channel, or if he could, then I believe that he must be dead. He's basically a hero, so if he could channel would he not have turned up around book 2 or 3 to do his "good guy" bit and teach Rand about saidin?
31
Aiel Finn: 2005-02-16
No channeling of anything other than from a well can happen in a steading. They are thick places in the pattern, sort of the opposite of SG. The reason that shadowspawn don't enter is that they lose their connection to the DO while they're inside.
