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Have a Dream

by brother of Battles: 2005-06-08 | 3.6 out of 10 (25 votes)

Previous Categories: Miscellaneous

“Rand's heart pounded as he ran, and he stared in dismay at the barren hills surrounding him. This was not just a place where spring was late in coming; spring had never come here, and never would come. Nothing grew in the cold soil that crunched under his boots, not so much as a bit of lichen. He scrambled past boulders, twice as tall as he was; dust coated the stone as if never a drop of rain had touched it. The sun was a swollen, blood red ball, more fiery that on the hottest day of summer and bright enough to sear his eyes, but it stood stark against a leaden cauldron of a sky where clouds of sharp black and silver roiled and boiled on every horizon. For all the swirling clouds, though, no breath of breeze stirred across the land, and despite the sullen sun the air burned cold like the depths of winter. Rand looked over his shoulder often as he ran, but he could not see his pursuers. Only desolate hills and jagged black mountains, many topped by tall plumes of dark smoke rising to join the milling clouds. If he could not see his hunters, thought, he could hear them, howling behind him, guttural voices shouting with the glee of the chase, howling with the joy of blood to come. Trollocs. Coming closer, and his strength was almost gone. With desperate haste he scrambled to the top of a knife-edged ridge, then dropped to his knees with a groan. Below him a sheer rock wall fell away, a thousand-foot cliff plummeting into a vast canyon. Steamy mists covered the canyon floor, their thick gray surface rolling in grim waves, rolling and breaking against the cliff beneath him, but more slowly than any ocean wave had ever moved. Patches of fog glowed red for an instant as if great fires had suddenly flared beneath, then died. Thunder rumbled in the depths of the valley, and lightning crackled through the gray, sometimes striking up at the sky. It was not the valley itself that sapped his strength and filled the empty spaces left with helplessness. From the center of the furious vapors a mountain thrust upward, a mountain taller than any he had ever seen in the mountains of Mist, a mountain as black as the loss of all hope. That bleak stone spire, a dagger stabbing at the heavens, was the source of his desolation. He had never seen it before, but he knew it. The memory of it flashed away like quicksilver when he tried to touch it, but the memory was there. He knew it was there.” EotW pb. Pg 119-120.

That was the Dream Rand had in the Winespring Inn while Tam slept; recovering from the fever dreams he was having from taking a wound. The dream continues right up to the point where he comes into contact with a Myrddraal. I didn't quote the whole thing here, mainly because if I did, this theory would be incredibly long. But the point is, we are all aware of this dream. It was the first time Rand had a dream that wasn't a dream. The common belief is that Rand had a dream of being at Shayol Ghul.

The purpose of this theory is thus. The dream we all read is in fact the end of the dream. When Rand got to Emond's Field the sun was just coming up.

“Gray first light came while Rand still trudged through the forest. At first he did not really see. When he finally did, he stared at the fading darkness in surprise.” EotW pb pg 89.

However, then he woke up, twilight was upon the land and the moon was clearly visible. (EotW pb pg 124) Where did the day go? An average dream lasts something like 17 sec. or whatever. That doesn't account for the day being gone. Here is what I think actually happened. But first I want to point out something about talents. It seems that every channeler has some kind of talent or ability. Egwene has dreamwalking, Nynaeve and Damer Flynn has healing, Moiraine has the trick of listening from a distance, Liandrin has a form of compulsion. The point is, all channelers have something. What is Rand's Talent or “Ability?” Rand has the Talent of being able to see the mirror worlds through his dreams.

“This one seems pale to us because it is a weak reflection, a world that had little chance of ever being. Others are almost as likely as ours. Those are as solid as our world, and have people. The same people, she says, Rand. Imagine it! You could go to one of them and meet yourself. The pattern has infinite variation, she says, and every variation that can be, will be.” THG pb pg 258.

As Loial was telling Rand, there are some worlds that are so closely related to “Randland” that everything could be exactly the same except one thing. Plus time runs differently in these worlds, so years could take place in a matter of hours in “Randland.”

“She says there are worlds where it is time rather than distance that changes. Spend a day in one of those, and you might come back to find a year has passed in the real world, or twenty. Or it could be that other way around. Those worlds-this one, all the others-are reflections of the real world, she says.” TGH pb pg 258.

I think the start of the dream takes place from the point right after Rand wakes up. This is what I believe happened. The beginning of The Eye of the World actually took place, everything up to the point where Rand fell asleep in the chair in Tam's room.

"When the door finally closed behind them, Rand dragged the lone chair in the room over beside the bed and sat down where he could watch Tam. It was all very well for Mistress al'Vere to talk about sleep-his jaws cracked as he stifled a yawn-but he could not sleep yet. Tam might wake at any time, and maybe only stay awake a short while. Rand had to be waiting when he did."

However, from that point on everything we have read has been a dream Rand has been having.

Everything from leaving Emond's Field to beyond the cleaning of the male half of the true source is only a dream. The part of the dream we read in the EotW, the end of the dream, is what happens at the end of the series. Rand woke up when he saw the Myrddraal at the White Tower. I think that Myrddraal is in fact Shaidar Haran. The reason Rand woke up at this point was because RJ didn't want everyone to know how the series ended so early in the books.

Well, I am sure I left out several key facts that could help push my theory, but I can't think of them right now. I will post them as soon as I can think of any. But, here it is. Have fun with this one; I just wanted to throw a wrench in everyone's way of thinking.
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Comments

1

Tamyrlin: 2005-06-11

To be honest, I like the thought; Stephen King recently finished his Dark Tower series (spoiler to those who read the Dark Tower series), and it reminds me of something he did to finish his series. It is tough sometimes to remember this entire book is RJ's dream; although, my thinking goes to Jordan. Does he seem like the kind of writer that would create such an elaborate series, that was simply a dream? I think you may be right, there might have been a Rand in a Mirror World where he simply had a bad dream, but I don't think that is how this will end, but it is a fun idea, nonetheless.

2

free will: 2005-06-11

Wow, I just finished chapter 8 of book one last night before going to bed and thought that the book could stop right there on "When the door finally closed behind them, Rand dragged the lone chair in the room over beside the bed and sat down where he could watch Tam. It was all very well for Mistress al'Vere to talk about sleep-his jaws cracked as he stifled a yawn-but he could not sleep yet. Tam might wake at any time, and maybe only stay awake a short while. Rand had to be waiting when he did." and that it would be a very good book. Not requiring sequels. And I know that for years some people have claimed that Book 1 as a whole is the entire series, but that's annoying with all the viewing and prophecies unfinished. I almost said "undone" instead of "unfinished", so you should thank me ;)

It really makes sense for that to be the end of the series to be when rand goes to sleep. In your theory RJ is going to keep writing the dream past where Rand woke up in chapter 9? Specifically with Shaidar Haran in the White Tower? I always wondered if Rand has to channel the True Power to seal Shai'tan. Maybe Shai'tan needs a powerful channeler to channel the True Power to free him. Do sa'angrael work with the True Power? I recently posted a balefire sealing theory, and I wonder if we could add that to yours. If the weave to free Shai'tan would actually seal him if stopped prematurely, then can you free Shai'tan, balefire the right person the exact right amount and then have Shai'tan bound? I'm trying to figure out why Shaidar Haran would be in the White Tower, along with why the Shai'tan would want Rand to be alive for the Last Battle, which seems to be the case. Maybe if Rand links with Shaidar Haran and Shadar Haran directs the flows and get balefired that would do it. Do you have any ideas what Shaidar Haran would be doing in the White Tower? And in the future won't the White Tower have the big Palace, could Rand really have not noticed that?

3

JakOShadows: 2005-06-12

That's an interesting theory. It would be a surprising plot twist, but it would disapoint me if the whole series was like that. In my mind, I always thought that everything was to be resolved in Randland. But I like your theory about the talent he has, because maybe that allows him to foretell the future paths he may take in his dreams. And it could also be tied to being able to touch T'A'R in some form too, hence Ishmael manipulating him.

4

Heron: 2005-06-13

JakOShadows: Possible, except that anyone can touch the Unseen World in their dreams. Not only that, but people can be "hooked" into it, or into a dream controlled by the one doing the "hooking", both of which (unless they're the same thing) the Wise ones see as evil... which fits Ishy like a glove. Egwene could probably do as good a job, now, as Ishy did, except for the dream wards. Nifty theory, though, Brother of Battles. I have mixed feelings about this theory; it's a cool idea, but it would suck if that actually happened.

5

free will: 2005-06-13

I think I interpreted this theory differently than some other people. I thought the theory was that the dream in book 1 chapter 9 took place in a mirror world where all the same stuff happens as in the books, and since Rand only remembers the end, at some point in a future book we'll get to the parts in the real world that he remembers from the Mirror world, and at that point Rand will remember them too. Since Tam's sword was poking into Rand's side during that part of the dream, making his side sore, I'd specifically predict that he'll meet the Myrddraal while still having his wound that doesn't heal. Everything in the books would be just as real, but Rand would have forknowledge of some future events (Trollocs in a springless SG, flowers in a winter brown TV, a Myrddraal inside the WT). Beyond that, Rand is without foreknowledge but the story will continue as is. But also that opens up some possibilities. Because after the WT Myrddraal, maybe Rand can get his side healed.

6

brother of Battles: 2005-06-13

Free Will-The Myrddraal could be in the WT for any number of reasons. Don't forget that TV has been going down hill ever since Elida became the Amyrlin for the WT. There are rats in the tower itself, trash pilling up in the city. It just sounds like TV is loosing the protection it once had against the Shadow.

You are also correct. While writing this theory, I wrote it thinking Rand had a dream of what happened in a very closly related mirror world. What is taking place now, is taking place, but Rand had already had a dream of it. When the Series draws to a close, We will see Rand going through the same steps he went through in his dream.

7

SDog: 2005-06-13

Seems to me a pretty weak point in your theory is the idea that Rand must have "dreamed" the day away.

Remember that people don't dream all the time during sleep. In fact, they dream more frequently shortly before they wake up. My point is, Rand could have just dropped into dreamless (non-REM) sleep upon sitting down in the chair. There's no reason to assume he had to start dreaming from the moment he fell asleep.

Moreover, you seem to be suggesting that Rand dreamed the end of the dream before he dreamed it. Is that right? I'm not quite sure what that has to do with Mirror Worlds, unless you're suggesting Rand dreamed the end of the dream in a MW? It's a little confusing.

8

Kantuna: 2005-06-14

Sdog,

**Moreover, you seem to be suggesting that Rand dreamed the end of the dream before he dreamed it. Is that right? I'm not quite sure what that has to do with Mirror Worlds, unless you're suggesting Rand dreamed the end of the dream in a MW? It's a little confusing. **

I don't theory is right, but I think that this is what is being suggested: in a Mirror world, Rand (The mirror Rand) was in the WT with Shaidar Haran (The Mirror SH). The Rand in Randworld was still in the two rivers only asleep. In effect, the real Rand was seeing the mirror Rand with the mirror SH, as if he was watching it on TV. Later on in the series, Rand (the real Rand) will reach the same point as the mirror Rand - he will be in the real White tower with the real Shaidar Haran in the same situation as the Mirror Rand that the real Rand dreamed of was in. This will give the Real Rand knowledge of what is coming next up to that point.

(Rand will probably make a concious choice to change what he does after remembering the mirror Rand.)

Hope that cleared things up for you. Slightly.

9

brother of Battles: 2005-06-14

SDog-

That isn't what I am suggesting. The part of the Dream we read in the Eye of the World was the end of the dream. He had a complete dream. We are now reading the dream that he had. But RJ couldn't put the whole dream in the one chapter because that would be the entire series. So RJ only wrote a fragment of the end. He didn't even write how the series ends, because Rand woke up. See what I mean, or do I need to try and explain it a bit more?

10

Shaitan: 2005-06-19

Not a bad theory, but I really doubt Jordan would end it like that. But I do think Rand has a special talent, and that is hes a male dreamer like egwene, the dream is a foretelling of the future if he would only just figure out what it ment, I think it means that when Rand finaly goes to the white tower, It will be seemingly in open arms, but realy the white tower will be run by BA, ie Alviarin,under the control of forsaken, and it will be a trap.

11

SDog: 2005-06-21

We are now reading the dream that he had. But RJ couldn't put the whole dream in the one chapter because that would be the entire series.

I follow that part now. I still don't get (from your theory) how the MWs are really involved. You said Rand can see the MWs through is dreams, but didn't explain what that has to do with the dream he was having.

Well, you did say that it could account for the time problem, but if he was dreaming of himself in a MW, then nothing he did was real, right? Are you suggesting that the MW he dreamed about is something very close to what will actually happen?

And finally (sorry for all the questions), what will happen when we reach the end of the dream (again) in the books? Is this taking place in a mirror world, or is it real? If we're just seeing the dream, how will the actual events be resolved?

12

WCDWarder: 2005-06-21

I remember seeing the movie "Vanilla Sky," which ends in a way similar to this theory. I hated it in Vanilla Sky, and I would hate it from RJ, too.

From another perspective, does it really make sense to write a work of fantasy and then have it end up all being a fantasy within the fantasy? After all, the genre is already accounting for the fantasy. What would a reader truly get out of it that (s)he wasn't already getting from the story itself if it's all just a dream in the end?

13

Ozymandias: 2005-06-24

This is more of a technical point. If Rand is in fact dreaming the entire series, the how can RJ do POV's for Egwene, Elayne, etc etc??? Since we see repeatedly (to the point where I am convinced RJ is sexist)that these women are wrong in their assumptions about Rand, I find it inherently impossible that the whole plotline is a dream. There is no way Rand's subconscious would let so many discrepancies go by. Plus, there is no way Rand could be ignorant of all of the plots and such; he would be omnipotent and therefore invincible. Its a nice theory, but I just don't think its possible

14

free will: 2005-06-24

Other POVs can be accomidated by this happening in a mirror world, just like brother of battles mentioned, that's Rand's special talent according to brother of battles.

As for the amazing advantage Rand would have if he'd dreamed the novels, he doesn't remember the part of the dream that wasn't written in the book.

I wonder if when we get past the dream, the POV from other character's will stop. Was their any POV stuff before the dream that didn't belong specifically to Rand? If not, the other character POVs might be from the mirror world version of the story, not the mainline version.

15

brother of Battles: 2005-06-24

SDog - Rand is Dreaming- but while dreaming he is actually veiwing a MW that is so much like RandLand, that it is in fact showing him what is to come. Also, somewhere in the WoT universe, I read that if the DO breaks out of any one world, he breaks out of all worlds. He could not see what happens in his MW dream because each world that has a threat of the DO must face it on their own. No matter the events leading up to it or how closely the worlds are joined.

WCDWarder - I saw that movie too, also didn't like it. But the Difference between that movie and this theory is-Rand isn't really having a dream. Everything we are reading is actually taking place on a MW.

Ozymandias - No Rand wouldn't be omnipotent or invinvible. Nor could he know everything that is happening. This so called "Dream" of his in not a true dream. He is getting a first hand prospective of what is going to happen. He is looking at himself in a very, very closely related MW. The plotline is not a dream, it will/was/is happening. Think of it not as a dream, instead think of it more as a premonition.

I don't know if this helped, or even if it is understood. Sometimes, I think I live in my own world.

16

free will: 2005-06-24

if he was dreaming of himself in a MW, then nothing he did was real, right?

IMO, correct, the mirror world actions wouldn't have been real, but Rand doesn't remember most of them anyway.

Are you suggesting that the MW he dreamed about is something very close to what will actually happen?

IMO, it was very very similar, similar enough that RJ won't repeat the second version and will instead jump back to the narration style of the book before the dream to describe the part in the real world where the part of Rand's dream that he remembers starts to happen.

The reader will have to assume that the dream and reality were similar enough to not mention what really happened.

And finally (sorry for all the questions), what will happen when we reach the end of the dream (again) in the books?

IMO, we won't. We'll get to right before Rand sees SG, or maybe him seeing it and remembering seeing it, and then the narration of the dream will end. Either the book will end (I doubt it) or it will then return to the pre-dream narration, skipping over leaving the Two Rivers and going straight to SG. Then Rand will remember the dream and remember going to the WT and the flowers and such and will use that memory to do something different. That's where the dream and reality will deviate for the first time. At least IMO.

Is this taking place in a mirror world, or is it real?

IMO, the books are the mirror relations of the events, not real since Rand fell asleep.

If we're just seeing the dream, how will the actual events be resolved?

IMO, RJ will gloss over the real events as being like the ones in the dream, up until SG, where the two diverge and in that case RJ already gave us the dream version, so then we'll get the real version.

does it really make sense to write a work of fantasy and then have it end up all being a fantasy within the fantasy?

IMO, it's not "just" a dream, it really happens too, but we've been seeing the dream part that Rand forgot, we haven't been reading the real version. At some point reality and the dream will deviate, you don't expect Rand to "wake up" from reality, do you?

What would a reader truly get out of it that (s)he wasn't already getting from the story itself

IMO, you get the fact that Rand figures out that Shadar Haran is expecting him in the WT instead of walking into the trap like he did in the dream version. If you read my theories about TG, I think Rand has to trick Shai'tan. But I think Shai'tan tries to trick Rand. Rand's dream is his secret weapon, he's never talked about it and he had it before anyone was watching his dreams, he'll use the dream to anticipate Shai'tan's trick and use that to advantage to trick Shai'tan. It's a little fact from book 1 that Shai'tan didn't know comning back to haunt him and save the day for Randland. I like the theory.

17

brother of Battles: 2005-08-22

Free Will-

I like how you explained it. However, what I am trying to say is that what is happening now, really is happening. This is all real. But Rand had already dreamed it in his MW dream. When he gets to TV in book 12, if that is where the series ends, he will say "wait a min. I know this, I have seen it before." Then he will know how to beat the DO. Which could also explain why Shadar Haran is at the White Tower.

I myself might have confussed some people in my original theory. I said...

"However, from that point on everything we have read has been a dream Rand has been having."

How I meant for it to sound was that What we are now reading is real. It is just that Rand has already seen it, just can't remember anything of it because he didn't think it was that important. He just wrote it off as a bad dream, but when the time comes he will remember a silly little dream he had in a lone chair next to a bed in a cozy little room at an Inn in a backwater flyspeck village a long time ago.