he Sad Braclets
by Anubis: 2003-01-18 | Not yet rated
Suroth has the braclets that can control a mans channeling. Now min had a vision that Aes Sedai would hurt rand unless perrin was near.
I'm just going to assume that aes sedai would include the damane, suldam, captured aes sedai, etc. I think that rand will get sad braceleted by suroth, and then perrin, who *gasp* just HAPPENS to be meeting with seanchan, will have to save him.
This will be number two, with the wells being number one.
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1
Tamyrlin: 2003-01-18
I had forgotten about the Perrin reference...how crazy. Perrin and Mat are actually close to each other at the present moment. Now, will Rand go looking for Perrin before he goes? After reading your theory, I am in hopes that Rand will be a bit smarter about this whole deal and try to collect as many Asha'man as possible...and that Min will remind him about her viewing. So, he takes Perrin and the Asha'man with him and somehow Perrin saves him from collaring...interesting.
2
Dedicated: 2003-01-28
Anubis, you supported one of my first theories, and I have to say I like this one. We are all assuming the series is winding down. And we'll all be eating our words when Book 23: Rand Installs a Deck On His House comes out :) Perrin is about due for his second time rescuing Rand. Min did say "women who can channel are going to hurt you" not "Aes Sedai are going to hurt you" right?
3
Callandor: 2003-01-29
I myself agree with the whole Perrin saving Rand (hopefully as Tam said he wont be so dang woolheaded to fall right into it and NOT think its a trap sheesh). But I have heard other theories saying that Perrin will cut off Rands hand. I myself dont like this idea... mostly because that Rand would almost for sure be wearing the necklace not the braclet. I think that Mins viewing of the hand around Rand would be Suroths (or whoever they get to be his keeper or leasher if you will). Again it doesnt have to be Rands hand cut off to be the severed hand that would effect him (and being controlled against your will seems to have a BIGGG effect... just look at poor Egwene).
4
siswa-aman: 2003-02-26
Doesn't tuon have the sad bracelets? also she trains damane (or did), and her using them would be fairly close to the seanchan prophecy of rand kneeling before the crystal throne!
5
Dedicated: 2003-02-26
Tuon doesn't have the sad bracelets. They are currently in the possession of Suroth, which is why we are worried about them in the first place.
6
Shadowkiller: 2003-03-27
It doesn't really matter wether Min said Aes Sedai or channellers. Suroth could mave Liandrin use the sad bracelet on Rand. She could still use it even shielded.
7
Anubis: 2003-04-06
alright, reread CoT (for like the 6th time) and i think i have it figured out. Perrin is gonna save rand and heres how... Rand gets captured... (cause thats what happens, dont ask me how.. he has calandor... he SHOULD be carrying that thing around (atleast i would)
Now recall that perrin has a letter from Suroth saying do whatever the bearer commands on my authority. We know how these things work. A hero is gonna use one against the writers wishes. (mat escaping tar valon) btw, the do what i say letter was masmeas. perrin got it from berelain, whose two presumably dead thief catchers grabbed it.
8
The Leveler: 2003-04-12
I thinks she'll disguise a sul'dam as the D of 9Ms and have her throw the bracelets around Rand, then revolt. Because #4 mentions her thinking if she did capture Rand, should she give him to the Empress.
9
Korell: 2003-04-22
Whatever happens there will have to be 2 channlers present because the Sad braclets require 2 female channlers to hold the one male channler and i think that Perrin will chop off the hand of atleast one of the female channlers and then Rand maybe over power the other female? cant remember the text but i know there was somthing about one female could not control it and i know it has 2 braclets
10
Callandor: 2003-04-22
It doesnt REQUIRE 2 women channelers, only one. The reason 2 is better is because the control that the man gets over the woman who uses the bracelet gets spread lesser to the 2 women instead of the one.
11
mattmcl: 2003-05-11
Just to follow up on the tangent, I've always associated Rand losing his hand with the Seanchan and the a'dam. But not the male a'dam...
If I remember correctly, we're told in TSR that the male a'dam is similar to the female a'dam. But rather than being silver, it's jet black and instead of a collar and bracelet, there are two bracelets... I assume that the two bracelets allow two less powerful channelers to control a very strong male damane (ie: the Dragon Reborn)
In any case, if Rand is trapped by Suroth, Anath, and Liandrin, then he will be collared with the male a'dam around his neck. So perhaps Rand or Perrin (whom Min saw would need to be there for Rand twice in order to survive) will be forced to sever the hands of those controlling the male a'dam? We certainly know that Perrin is capable of cutting off people's hands...
There is one other possibility. I remember reading somewhere in the series that the Seanchan have been known to take a collared damane female and put the bracelet on the wrist of a man who can channel. Both male and female were said to die horribly. Perhaps now that Saidin has been cleansed, the Dark One or a Forsaken will try to kill Rand rather than collar him? If so, Rand may still lose his own hand, as someone close to him will sever it to save him...
This raised one more question for me: if a man and woman that are connected by a regular a'dam horribly die, wouldn't two women controlling a male damane through the male a'dam also horribly die? Perhaps two males will be required to control Rand through the black a'dam? Of course, in the beginning of the series, two males who could channel would have been hard to come by... But with a few male Forsaken or perhaps a couple of renegade Asha'men, Suroth shouldn't have a problem catching Rand.
12
Callandor: 2003-05-11
The adam only kills both SOMETIMES, not always. Suroth or Renna remarks on it in TGH soon after Egwene is captured. The Empress would put a damane with a person of the Blood, and they both dont know if they will live or die so it makes the Blood uneasy. But they dont always die.
And the male adam isnt an exact smae thing as the female adam. The male adam is made of Cuendillar, not just a ter angreal. It uses 1 or 2 women to control a man. THe downfall is that the man eventually gains control over the women. Thats why 2 women controlling the man is better, so the control the man gets is reduced. And they wouldnt die screaming because it is designed differently for the specific purpose of women controlling the male channeler.
13
mattmcl: 2003-05-12
After checking the books, I agree that the male a'dam is intended for females (1 or 2) to control a male damane.
However, I believe that the reason that a damane and a male of the Blood don't always die when attached to one another through a regular a'dam is because the male isn't a channeler. My guess is that if a female damane (obviously a channeler) and a random male of the Blood (who can be taught to channel, not a wilder) are connected through an a'dam, then both will die. If the male can not be taught to channel saidin, then the attached pair won't die.
We know that sul'dams are merely women in Seanchan society that can channel if taught, whereas damane are wilders. So I would guess that if a regular woman that can't channel were collared by a sul'dam, nothing would happen. Similarly, nothing would happen if a collared damane were attached to a woman that can't channel. The a'dam allows a woman that can be taught to channel to control a wilder that eventually channels, whether she wants to or not. My guess is that sul'dams control the damane through the bracelet by channeling, but without knowledge of what they are doing. They probably learn mind techniques like the kind that Egwene uses (a river flowing) or similar to the kind that Rand uses (the flame being fed in his mind), which the sul'dam believe allows them control of damane, when in fact, they're embracing the source.
So, the regular a'dam requires a collared woman that can channel and a woman that can learn to channel controlling the ‘link' through the bracelet. Perhaps normal a'dams were originally created with this in mind. We know that an Aes Sedai that tried to curry favor with Hawkwing's son made the first a'dam. Obviously, she could channel. So, I suggest that the first a'dam was intended for a link between two people using saidar. However, adding a male into the equation creates an unseen problem, a link between someone using saidar and another using saidin. Think of it like jumper cables for your car: cross the black and red wires on the wrong connection points and you get shocked. The people who originally created the male a'dam might have been aware of this problem and created the male a'dam to address this, allowing female channelers to control a male damane. Also, since the a'dams were created after the Breaking, in a world where male channelers go mad from the taint, the two bracelets might have been a precaution for women who were worried about contracting the madness through the a'dam. This way, the taint was distributed between two women, rather than all at once in one woman. Or, as pointed out, the male a'dam was not created in the same way as a regular a'dam (which allows the sul'dam to control the damane through the link). Perhaps in their experimentation, the creators of the male a'dam made it imperfectly – allowing two women to control a male damane, but allowing the collared male to eventually control the two women through the link, like a type of compulsion. Perhaps a type of compulsion is used in the regular a'dam between sul'dam and damane. We simply do not know.
If this theory is right, I would assume that if Rand were attached to a damane through a normal a'dam (with Rand wearing the bracelet and the collar around a female's neck), both would die screaming... Unless someone was able to separate the two before permanent damage occurred. And the quickest way to sever the link in such a situation might be for someone to cut off Rand's hand and slip the bracelet off and then heal the wound using the One Power, such as when Perrin cut the Aiel's hand off in COT.
14
Shadow Bane: 2003-06-18
Just wanted to say the only problem i see. If the sul'dam can channel even just a little wouldn't the damane see it? If a woman embraces saidar she glows to other women who can channel so the sul dam must use another way to control the damane other than channeling.
15
Dorindha: 2003-06-19
I don't think a damane would think it weird to see a glow round a sul'dam - if it is always there, and I presume it is, they would assuume it is just part of being a sul'dam, rather than a sign of actual channelling. After all, not just any one can be a sul'dam.
16
Aelfinn: 2003-11-28
I asked somebody, and she said that it would be easier to slip a bracelet on somebody than a necklace.
To my thinking, if a channeler wasn't suspecting anything, it would be simplest to just collar them (see Egwene in TGH). You can just sneak up behind them and *bam* it's snapped on their neck before they know what's happening. However, if someone knows what's happening and is fighting everyone, thrashing about, then reaching their neck is gonna be if not impossible then very difficult. Putting the bracelet part of the a'dam on someone like that would be MUCH easier.
BTW, remember that in TGH Elayne said that Min saw a 'severed hand' for her. You're allowed thinking that the hand doesn't have anything to do with it, but what about Elayne's part? If she's just sitting around at home chatting, wouldn't it be seen for Aviendha as well? Both are Rand's girls.
17
Aiel Finn: 2005-02-10
Both the normal a'dam and the sad braclets are ter'angreal for making links/circles. The die screaming effect is that the a'dam is made for female circles only, and cannot handle sadin. There cannot be a male only a'dam because two men cannot link without a female (or sadiar channeler).
